Here we go again.......friggin' savior's of the earth!

[catinthehat]

There are no draws on wolves...shoot all the wolves you want, there is no 'limit'. Hunters cant control their populations.

For the record, I have 2 pictures of wolf tracks on snowmobile tracks .... just saying.

We wont win this battle as long as there are caribou... solution is a hunting season for caribou... problem solved Unless of course the Forestry Industry will cave in.

-------------

and what's wrong with seal hunting? Do we only eat the ugly animals?

There is nobody denying the wolves are out there, You are bound to find tracks somewhere sometime but there is no way to prove they are following our tracks anyplace, in fact the scientific facts show the mortality rate of caribou during our riding season is the least of all seasons and most if not all are due to natural causes ( avalanches claim quite a few ).
As to not winning this battle as long as there are caribou you may be right, but that is not to say it can't be done.

 

[jaredszakacs]

maybe somebody in the states maybe able to help us out as well there a lot of good spokesman out there A really good one for the sport is actually chris burandt considering he had the government close down an area just for his own private use for guiding and showing the clients the true fun of snowmobiling and how fun and harmless it really can be. and yes moyiesledhead I know some of the stuff on here wouldnt be a good thing to say to an enviromentalists at a meeting thats why i'm not volunteering to be the spokeman but volunteering my time and money to help get this going! I know there are a few bummed people who have been trying for years and have little help and support well here is the chance you got guys chomping at the bit to try and get something going and wanna see a change but some are acting like it can never be done. Anyone know of a really good spokesperson for this issue?

 

[zoomer2]

[h=2]Re: Here we go again.......friggin' savior's of the earth![/h]

"i am all for saving the animals, but seriously, let them die off. They are a stupid species and are going to fail. Its only a matter of time, we cannot play god by controlling couger and wolf populations. Its the way mother nature wants it to be. As a side note it does work both ways as in caribous can use the tracks to escape on coming predators.

Just a questions though, if they all parish.... does this mean the closures will be lifted"

This is precisely the level of ignorance that the public views our sport in. Time to pull up our socks and conduct our activities in a more responsible manner. There is enough space for sleddin in I'm happy, I don't need to ruin wildlife or wish them to die off. I don't need to ruin other peoples experiences by forcing my own values on them. Let it be and stay out of closed areas, times are a changin, gas is getting expensive. Two strokes are kind of stinky too!

​

 

[Modman]

I know your bummed by the other posts 2 ahead 1 back but something has to happen and I think with the last few years closures we all can see there is a serious demand for it

thanks for the warm fuzzy but I'm not that bummed.... LOL just need to be realistic. Its easy to see that many people in the countryside take sleddin for granted. This site is a classic example, with the exception of people like Ferniesnow, moyiesledhead, and a few others, you got some BC residents who seem to have a hate on for "Albertans", but yet are enjoying the same mountain terrain us "flatlanders" are currently fighting for. Buy a membership, sign our petitions to keep riding areas open, just don't actually come here...? Better start realizing that "united we will stand or divided we will fall".

I covered this in a thread I started last year https://www.snowandmud.com/forum/f14/our-sport-dying-why-we-need-45669.html . . I got a couple emails from Alberta-based folks who said that we had a lot of the stats etc that I referenced in my post, but nothing else. So we have them already (or at least some of them), why do we not have a spokeperson on the news weekly in the winter, saying all the good things? Where is our rebuttal in the Vancouver Sun? The province of BC has 2 governing sled groups does it not? Why are they not a huge presence on these sites telling us what direction they need help in? Personally I have invited journalists out to come sledding, all who had written condemning articles regarding sledding, and they all declined (imagine that - condemn a sport you have never participated in....).

I'm an environmental scientist and work with real biologists daily, who laugh at these "studies" done by environmental groups. Tell me what you need, I will do some leg work, I will write something up, I will engage my colleagues. But I don't know what or where. We don't need another group chasing its tail IMO, let's focus the efforts where they matter and get a face in the news, not divide our resources even further.

 

[jaredszakacs]

modman just so you know me and OOC zig zag have been talking a bit today back and forth and are really really trying to get this figured out as well. we had the thoughts you have and had of getting it on the news and showing how much fun it really is. we are trying to think of some good PR reps that would be beneficial I even mentioned trying to get the operators and chatter creek and the bugaboo heli and cat ski lodges that allow snowmobilers into there private terrain before and after there season. and you are 100% right as sledders we need to stand together enough with this alberta bc crap it is absolute BS and that is the truth!

 

[Scotty]

wonder if our government is smart enough to know the wolves have cross bred with the coyotees

More like the polititions have cross bread with wolves.

 

[catinthehat]

Yes there are now 2 governing sled groups in BC, however since the split happened there are no longer enough members in either group to fund a paid rep. ( the BCSF had one for a while ). The volunteers that are now running both groups have not got the time or experience to take on a task of this magnitude,
How we would go about raising the funds and controlling their use is another job in and of itself.IMO.

 

[ferniesnow]

Now we are starting to talk about things that matter. The two provincial organizations have the money we just have to find a way to channel that money into back-country access. IMHO, the other items of business on their agendas could just about be accomplished by the volunteers or maybe someone part-time.

A brain storming session on available personnel would be a start. That session should have the head honcho's of the organizations (BCSF, ABCSnow,ASA, SSA, and maybe even the CSA) throwing out names of possible candidates. But I don't think it is on the BC organization's radar. How we get them to move is another question.

 

[OOC ZigZag]

thanks for the warm fuzzy but I'm not that bummed.... LOL just need to be realistic. Its easy to see that many people in the countryside take sleddin for granted. This site is a classic example, with the exception of people like Ferniesnow, moyiesledhead, and a few others, you got some BC residents who seem to have a hate on for "Albertans", but yet are enjoying the same mountain terrain us "flatlanders" are currently fighting for. Buy a membership, sign our petitions to keep riding areas open, just don't actually come here...? Better start realizing that "united we will stand or divided we will fall".

I covered this in a thread I started last year https://www.snowandmud.com/forum/f14/our-sport-dying-why-we-need-45669.html . . I got a couple emails from Alberta-based folks who said that we had a lot of the stats etc that I referenced in my post, but nothing else. So we have them already (or at least some of them), why do we not have a spokeperson on the news weekly in the winter, saying all the good things? Where is our rebuttal in the Vancouver Sun? The province of BC has 2 governing sled groups does it not? Why are they not a huge presence on these sites telling us what direction they need help in? Personally I have invited journalists out to come sledding, all who had written condemning articles regarding sledding, and they all declined (imagine that - condemn a sport you have never participated in....).

I'm an environmental scientist and work with real biologists daily, who laugh at these "studies" done by environmental groups. Tell me what you need, I will do some leg work, I will write something up, I will engage my colleagues. But I don't know what or where. We don't need another group chasing its tail IMO, let's focus the efforts where they matter and get a face in the news, not divide our resources even further.

Now we are starting to talk about things that matter. The two provincial organizations have the money we just have to find a way to channel that money into back-country access. IMHO, the other items of business on their agendas could just about be accomplished by the volunteers or maybe someone part-time.

A brain storming session on available personnel would be a start. That session should have the head honcho's of the organizations (BCSF, ABCSnow,ASA, SSA, and maybe even the CSA) throwing out names of possible candidates. But I don't think it is on the BC organization's radar. How we get them to move is another question.

I hope the 2 groups representing sledders are listening and its not out of the norm to see another group formed to deal with the BC use issues. I think possibly the BCSF and ABC have their hands full due to the lack of response to past situations. I posted on your topic last yr and agreed. If the groups currently representing sledders in the province of BC were doing a great job we wouldnt be posting here now. Jared and myself have started constructive conversation on the approach and the people needed to help the effort along. Sad your efforts have not had better results. We will be pursuing a media ride where we will provide the equipment and the guides and try to leave them with a feeling of family for the sport. Not the juiced up junk head in the lifted truck with the tunes blaring and the pipe that rattles your ear drums. Get the media turned around and the population will follow it is that simple.

 

[RevyG]

As I have stated on numerous occasions, the first thing that needs to happen is go back to ONE governing body. How can we show a united front when we cannot even play nice with each other !? We end up perpetuating the“just a bunch of redneck aholes that don’t give a crap” stereotype.

I do know that the last time the local biologist flew the zones around here(revy) looking for compliance in the caribou closed areas he was impressed with our level of restraint, and he knows it takes a group effort for that level of restraint. Every little bit......

 

[ferniesnow]

....... We will be pursuing a media ride where we will provide the equipment and the guides and try to leave them with a feeling of family for the sport. Not the juiced up junk head in the lifted truck with the tunes blaring and the pipe that rattles your ear drums. Get the media turned around and the population will follow it is that simple.

That sounds like a great idea. A good family ride with a wiener roast lunch and a chance to enjoy the camaraderie may do wonders. A word of advice; don't expect the Free Press from Fernie to give you any accolades!! They wouldn't even report on MMV (before or after) and if we wanted we could buy an advertisement. Green through and through!

 

[TheMuffinMan]

Funny, every article I found said that wolf and cougar numbers are either stable or falling. Not exactly the boom they were talking about in that article. Working in archaeology I get to spend a lot of time working in the bush with first-nations consultants. Every one of them I've talked to about that article thought it was the dumbest thing they've ever heard. Wolves do not follow snowmobile tracks because they prefer to travel under tree cover. It's the ungulates that travel on sled trails so if anything snowmobiling is helping them by providing easy access to new foraging areas. I've done a lot of sledding in the BC north (where wolf populations are much higher than in the south), using the same access trails day after day, sometimes for several consecutive weeks, and I can't ever recall seeing wolf tracks or any other sign that predators were using our trails as a hunting highway.

 

[moyiesledhead]

Part of an e-mail I just recieved:

"Ten mountain caribou cows were captured yesterday February 29, 2012 from the Level Kawdy herd. These animals are currently being kept in a pen. The plan is to capture the other ten animals tomorrow. These animals are the ones that were previously captured and collared. There is a team of veterinarians that are monitoring these animals and so far so good. All animals have been able to manage the stress. The transport has been scheduled for Friday and the release is scheduled for Saturday. Three caribou have already been collared in the South Purcell herd and the transplant animals will be released in close proximity to these animals. To date no predator management has been completed in the release area however 8 cougars and 3 active wolves have been collared."

So.....the South Purcell herd is about to go from 15 to 35. It's smorgasbord time!

 

[deaner]

Our tax dollars hard at work

 

[powderhoundbrr]

It will be interesting to monitor over the next 2 years and see if they do in fact survive or not. I am betting that this will be a colossal waste of money and the predators will get them but it will be interesting to see the government reports monitoring numbers.

 

[ferniesnow]

Part of an e-mail I just recieved:

"Ten mountain caribou cows were captured yesterday February 29, 2012 from the Level Kawdy herd. These animals are currently being kept in a pen. The plan is to capture the other ten animals tomorrow. These animals are the ones that were previously captured and collared. There is a team of veterinarians that are monitoring these animals and so far so good. All animals have been able to manage the stress. The transport has been scheduled for Friday and the release is scheduled for Saturday. Three caribou have already been collared in the South Purcell herd and the transplant animals will be released in close proximity to these animals. To date no predator management has been completed in the release area however 8 cougars and 3 active wolves have been collared."

So.....the South Purcell herd is about to go from 15 to 35. It's smorgasbord time!

I'm always receptive to learning but to learn I have to ask questions. The cows should be pregnant and the snow in the South Purcells should be at it's height for the winter. For those 2 reasons, is it an ideal time to try to transplant these animals?

 

[moyiesledhead]

I'm always receptive to learning but to learn I have to ask questions. The cows should be pregnant and the snow in the South Purcells should be at it's height for the winter. For those 2 reasons, is it an ideal time to try to transplant these animals?

It's about right actually. Gives the new animals a chance to get familiar with the others and how to survive in a different environment than they're used to before they move to lower elevations in mid April. I know some of the biologists involved in this project and I do trust they know what they're doing.

 

[Modman]

Being that the snow is low this year, hopefully they will survive and the population starts to rebound.

 

[moyiesledhead]

Being that the snow is low this year, hopefully they will survive and the population starts to rebound.

Actually....our snow is right where it was last year. But low snow actually makes it harder to reach the tree lichens they survive on in the winter. Low snow years are harder on them than a normal winter.

 

[Kavaleen]

I got a couple emails from Alberta-based folks who said that we had a lot of the stats etc that I referenced in my post, but nothing else. So we have them already (or at least some of them), why do we not have a spokeperson on the news weekly in the winter, saying all the good things? Where is our rebuttal in the Vancouver Sun? The province of BC has 2 governing sled groups does it not? Why are they not a huge presence on these sites telling us what direction they need help in? Personally I have invited journalists out to come sledding, all who had written condemning articles regarding sledding, and they all declined (imagine that - condemn a sport you have never participated in....).

I'm an environmental scientist and work with real biologists daily, who laugh at these "studies" done by environmental groups. Tell me what you need, I will do some leg work, I will write something up, I will engage my colleagues. But I don't know what or where. We don't need another group chasing its tail IMO, let's focus the efforts where they matter and get a face in the news, not divide our resources even further.[/QUOTE]

If you get a chance to chat with the Whitecourt Sled Group they have a media ride every year and they have a great turnout from the media and the government. Give them a shout and see if you could use their contacts, they may have some ideas that will work for you too.