Saskatchewan Trails

[rzrgade]

Open Letter to ATV Users and Organizers of ATV Events in Saskatchewan
Dear ATV Enthusiasts The Sask. Snowmobile Assoc. and our Member Clubs host 10,000 KM of snowmobile trail in the province. Over the past 15 years the Snowmobile Clubs and volunteers have invested time and resources to upgrade and provide the snowmobiler with a safe environment to operate snowmobiles. Over the past 5 years we have and continue to see pressure from ATV use on the snowmobile trail system. The operation of ATV’s on the snowmobile trails is causing damage to the surface in which the snowmobile trail is constructed. Larger, deeper and longer ruts in wet areas, damage to hill sides and valleys, damage to creeks and waterways are creating safety concerns and increased costs to the snowmobile clubs. Landowners that provide access have voiced concern with land & fence damage and this causing problems with cattle. Litter and damage at the trail side shelters is posing issues as well as added costs for the clubs.
On behalf of the snowmobile clubs and volunteers we ask that all ATV enthusiasts respect the environment, give consideration to wetlands, creeks and waterways. Use your ATV in a respectful manner and treat the environment like it’s your personal backyard.
We ask that you respect the snowmobile trail system and avoid operating your ATV on snowmobile trails.

A message from the Saskatchewan Snowmobile Association and its Member Clubs

Sorry but i filed this in the nonsense catagory when you implied that:
A:They are YOUR trails only.
B:Only atvs leave garbage.
C:Only atvers cut fences.

Sorry ,until you become part of the real world you are wasting our time............

 

[BIG DAWG]

I dont know about you guys but the way I just read this I believe He is trying to make a valid point but has been misinterpreted to some degree. With many snowmobile trails there is access granted where it would not be to atvs simply due to crops and cattle being at pasture, there are probably designated fence openings/gates that are left open during the winter season as the snowmobiles do not interfere being that the crops are off and cattle are not at pasture. also think about the damage that non respectful atvers would leave in wet private land ie sloughs/creeks etc. rzrgade i realice that you and I would simply not venture into private land fenced off with cattle grazing or through standing crops however unfortunatly their are those who do without thinking of the consequences. Not by any means saying that snowmobilers never cut fence but you cannot argue that their are those yahoos out their that when riding on a snowmobile trail and encounter a closed gate ,or locked would either continue through or cut fence to continue through onto what would be a trail in the winter.

Not trying to get in a pizzing match just trying to offer a little insight based on personal experiance.

 

[Murminator]

Ya I read tons of posts how snowmobile cabins wrecked in the mountians and garbage and carnage left behind on the mountian trails all of these acessed by snowmobile only.....I know it must be them damn sask atv riders going to the mountians in the winter

 

[Pup]

I dont know about you guys but the way I just read this I believe He is trying to make a valid point but has been misinterpreted to some degree. With many snowmobile trails there is access granted where it would not be to atvs simply due to crops and cattle being at pasture, there are probably designated fence openings/gates that are left open during the winter season as the snowmobiles do not interfere being that the crops are off and cattle are not at pasture. also think about the damage that non respectful atvers would leave in wet private land ie sloughs/creeks etc. rzrgade i realice that you and I would simply not venture into private land fenced off with cattle grazing or through standing crops however unfortunatly their are those who do without thinking of the consequences. Not by any means saying that snowmobilers never cut fence but you cannot argue that their are those yahoos out their that when riding on a snowmobile trail and encounter a closed gate ,or locked would either continue through or cut fence to continue through onto what would be a trail in the winter.

Not trying to get in a pizzing match just trying to offer a little insight based on personal experiance.

BIG DAWG,

We all wish it was as simple as mistinterpreting what has been said.

The SSA has made it VERY clear on what they are saying. The SSA may post something on here that is a little vague, but in conversations, letters etc, they have made it very clear what they are after.

They view ALL trails as if they were snowmobile trails ONLY. And as such, no one else should be allowed on them at any time of year.
Now we as ATVers, are not trying to get access to the snowmobile trails that are on private land. We do not have access, case closed on those. So that being said, it should not be an issure with fences being cut etc on those trails, cuz we just should not be on them.

I have a copy of the agreement that the SSA has with the gov't for the trails on crown land. In there it states that the trails are open to all public and that they cannot restrict access to the public. That means ATvs CAn go on them. Those trails are not owned by the SSA, even though they act like they are.

We have also asked who is doing the complaining about fences being cut, what area they are from, what snowmobile club is doing the griping. But we can't get any answer. There are a number of clubs that are both ATV & snowmobile, and they would like to know too. If it is an isolated incedent, then maybe we could work to turn around our image in that area.

In my time ATVing, I have never been with anyone that has cut a fence. In my time snowmobiling, I haven't seen anyone cut a fence, but I have seen someone go thru a fence. Not much difference in the long run, the fence is cut. As a sledder, you have more opportunity to come up on fences, as most people go cross country.

 

[Pup]

Here is a story from another forum. I'm sure it is an isolated inceident, but it shows all they care about is the trails.

Hey
guys I'm new here, been snooping around for awhile now and finally decided to
register. I want to share my experience with our local snowmobile club, I was
reading this thread and thought this kind of nonsense was somewhat isolated but
apparently not. My father in law lives a mile outside of the city here and for
several years now the local club has claimed the frontage of his two quarters
bordering the grid as part of their groomed trail system. Now my father in law
is one of those guys who doesn't want any trouble with anyone and hasn't
protested this at all, considering they never approached him for permission. So
we put up with the garbage left behind, the beer cans/bottles, the people coming
through the yard at all hours of the night, idiot drivers, I can go on all
night. This is a century family farm and we're all quite proud of it and nice
sign graced the end of the lane. One morning going out to the farm we find the
sign destroyed in what looked to be a collision with a snowmobile. A little
concerned if anyone was hurt and little pissed off that the sign was destroyed I
contacted the president of the club and asked him if he knew anything about this
and ofcourse no was the answer and he would get back to us. Some time later he
stopped out at the farm and claimed he had no idea why no one had asked my
father in law for permission prior to that day and proceded to ask for the next
season's access, with no mention to replacing his sign. Wish I would have been
there, the end result would have been alot different.
​

 

[BIG DAWG]

Did not realise this issue was this deep got the impression SSA was making a plea due to preasure from private land owners as I know some of these same issues plague my fathers farm but with no local club or organized trails it never gets heard. and has no issues with sledders on the property during the winter season using respect and no problems with atvers either if permission is asked and respect is shown

 

[grizzlymud]

The most resent posts were about a atv rally held and organized by a local community as a fundraiser for there Hall which makes money to run it all year. There was a bunch of false info bashing and making atv users look bad then once questions were asked they wouldn't answer or admit they had no proof or clue. But the damage had already been done and this is how the SSA seems to be working and trying to make us look bad but more and more see right threw there BS and are not supporting them, as I will not be doing anytime soon. We also asked when there meetings were so we could go and express concerns and maybe get to the bottom of this little kid, high school ch!t. As is written we have just as much right being on the provincial trails as they do so maybe we should start posting that they are wrecking our trails seeing as we could ride them all year but choose to only ride when there is no snow. The way they are going about this is childish and going to HURT EVERYONE in the long run. We need to join together and show we can use the trails responsibly before they get taken away.

 

[grizzlymud]

I also find it weird that the SSA posted this and hasn't posted a response,or even any more posts, same as they did in every other form they posted this on. Why is that? Think about that when you post.

 

[idler]

I dont know about you guys but the way I just read this I believe He is trying to make a valid point but has been misinterpreted to some degree. With many snowmobile trails there is access granted where it would not be to atvs simply due to crops and cattle being at pasture, there are probably designated fence openings/gates that are left open during the winter season as the snowmobiles do not interfere being that the crops are off and cattle are not at pasture. also think about the damage that non respectful atvers would leave in wet private land ie sloughs/creeks etc. rzrgade i realice that you and I would simply not venture into private land fenced off with cattle grazing or through standing crops however unfortunatly their are those who do without thinking of the consequences. Not by any means saying that snowmobilers never cut fence but you cannot argue that their are those yahoos out their that when riding on a snowmobile trail and encounter a closed gate ,or locked would either continue through or cut fence to continue through onto what would be a trail in the winter.

Not trying to get in a pizzing match just trying to offer a little insight based on personal experiance.

Its my understanding that the majority of the trails in question are those on crown property, as trails on farmland would be a simple case of trespassing, and would have nothing to do with the SSA, as the trails are not marked year round south of the bushline, so there is no SSA trails during summer months on farm land.

 

[Murminator]

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• ,

 

[Sledderglen]

Good to see some ATV clubs getting formed and working together. Nice to read how some ATV clubs clear trails of deadfall clen up and use the snowmobile trails. Problem I see is who is responsible to repair the trail after a season of ATV use. Who is responsible to repair the ruts and mud holes that are now visible for the government officials to inspect. Maybe it would be easier to just close down the whole area instead of to have the damage continue. Just asking the question. Who is responsible to get the trail back into the shape it was before the ATV abuse?
This has happenend here in Alberta so Sask. beware its coming

 

[pete 1]

Good to see some ATV clubs getting formed and working together. Nice to read how some ATV clubs clear trails of deadfall clen up and use the snowmobile trails. Problem I see is who is responsible to repair the trail after a season of ATV use. Who is responsible to repair the ruts and mud holes that are now visible for the government officials to inspect. Maybe it would be easier to just close down the whole area instead of to have the damage continue. Just asking the question. Who is responsible to get the trail back into the shape it was before the ATV abuse?
This has happenend here in Alberta so Sask. beware its coming

this is my thoughts also if the atvers dont fix it who does acording to some they magicly fix themselves

 

[idler]

Good to see some ATV clubs getting formed and working together. Nice to read how some ATV clubs clear trails of deadfall clen up and use the snowmobile trails. Problem I see is who is responsible to repair the trail after a season of ATV use. Who is responsible to repair the ruts and mud holes that are now visible for the government officials to inspect. Maybe it would be easier to just close down the whole area instead of to have the damage continue. Just asking the question. Who is responsible to get the trail back into the shape it was before the ATV abuse?
This has happenend here in Alberta so Sask. beware its coming

Sledderglen, you must have missed the post by Pup, where he stated as of right now, the saskatchewan ATV community can't really do much trail maintnence, not until some kind of arrangement has been made to the SK gov, which SATVA is working on, it'll all happen, but with time.

You said that in Alberta some or all sled trails have been closed to ATV'rs, didn't your ATV registration (plates) protect your right to ride these trails? I've been told that this is one of the reasons SASK wants registrations, to protect our right to ride.

 

[kidder17]

What are we to believe? If the SATVA wants to go to meetings and spread the good word of everything they are saying, then stop posting videos like these.

This is a quote from Ostacrusiers Video(Video#2) Tagline- "This video was taken on marked multi-use trails, please do your part to keep ATV'ing sustainable in the future. Please pack out what you pack in and stay on the trails"..... How did all the oil from the swamped ATV's that is dumped get packed out of the bush? Is riding and swamping an ATV in a lake staying on the trails? This is the preception that is out there to the public.

Everything that I printed in the last paragraph I am guilty of as well. It is fun as heck at the time, but I think we need to start changing our attitude on how we ride.

Taken from the SATVA Website, part of the SATVA Mission Statement and core values:
Unite all ATV clubs in Saskatchewan as one strong group with a clear voice.
Favor a spirit of cooperation with the Province's Law Enforcement.
Represent the interest of ATV’ers during the preparation of laws.
Help with the protection of the environment.
Maintain and encourage a positive public image.
Focus on advancing training and safety to users, specifically youth
Instill family values while on the trail.
Promote responsible ATV use.
Protect our right to ride.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hVagJxdaSL8&feature=relmfu

Swamp City - YouTube

 

[grizzlymud]

Who said oil was dumped? No one! Its people like YOU that ASS-U-ME things and cause problems. Do you know where the trails are? From your posts it doesn't sound like it. Like I said before do some research before you make statements.

 

[kidder17]

Well the first video is from one of the Rallies this spring in Chitek Lake. There are other YouTube Videos from this same self repairing mud hole from the same YouTube poster stating this. So I have no reason to doubt the person who posted it on YouTube for the world to see. The second is from Ostacruiser, a well known YouTube poster with some amazing ATV videos I must admit, they are fun to watch. A quick search on saskhardcoreatv forums and from reading his YouTube video descriptions put him in the Prince Albert area and it would seem he hits quite a few of the rallies around Saskatchewan.
He has even replied in this post.

As far as the oil dumping goes, well I too have been on rallies and rides where bikes have been swamped and I as well as you know the oil is dumped on the ground, new oil put in and off you go to the next hole. Like I said I am as guilty as other people that have done it, when you are 20 miles from anywhere you do what you have to do. What I am pointing out is don't put a description to respect and stay on trails and to pack out what you pack in and then show a video of 15+ quads being swamped.

I can't believe I entered back into this discussion.

 

[Mike270412]

I can't believe I entered back into this discussion.

-Never argue with idiots! They'll drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience!

 

[kidder17]

GrizzlyMud, Not sure why the personal attacks. I have no problem if your reply back is harsh towards the topic of discussion by the original poster, but to personally attack me because of my view point is not acceptable.

To help you out with your Ass-u-me comment. Usually that is used if for example in my post I would say that I had assumed something, you then come back and say " to assume is to make an Ass out of you and me"

 

[kidder17]

-Never argue with idiots! They'll drag you down to their level, then beat you with experience!

Your right Mike of many numbers, I should have read my own signature line. Oops, that was sort of a personal attack.....sorry

 

[grizzlymud]

Sorry wasn't meant to be a personal attack but do you realize the only people you are helping here are the ones who are trying to get quading shut down on trails which will in turn give the tree huggers amo to shut down sledding on these trails! Do you sledders seriously think that if you get quading banned from gov't trails what is going to be next? Cough cough sleds! And with them putting up false accusations about quaders what do you think will get done right back? Like posted before need to GROW UP AND BE ADULTS AND WORK TOGETHER but you guys just can't see that and its either all your or nothing which is what is going to happen. Being as such I'm done with this, all it is doing is giving the SSA what they want. There like the kid in the group on the playground, sucker punches a kid then runs away and watches the brawl break out.