New Sled Questions

[szprod]

Wow sleds have changed so much. I want to buy a sled and went to a dealer today to take a look and boy ohh boy how sleds are completely different from when I was young and rode my dad's 89 bombardier sleds. I learned quite a bit of information but I wanted the members opinions and expertise.
I want a sled that can do both trail riding and mountain riding but primarily trail riding for now until I gain enough experience to tackle the mountains.

Things that I for sure want are:

-I only want to buy Ski-Doo
-I must add a 2 up seat

Questions I have for you are:

-How much HP would be needed? Sometimes I will be alone and other times I will have my other half on with me and need enough power for both trails and mountains.

-Should I get 2 stroke or 4 stroke?

-What is the best track length? I want a track length that I don't get stuck all the time but also one that's agile for trails. Maybe meet somewhere in the middle?

-Is worth getting extended warranty?

The dealer I spoke to today recommended I go with this Renegade Backcountry Rotax E-TEC 800R:



He said I would just add the 2 up seat and foot posts for the passenger. He said the 800 would ensure myself plus a passenger could get through the snow on trials or in the mountains. I told him the only other thing I would want to add is pull start because it was only electric and he said that's no problem.

Any feedback from you guys with some experience would be great :d

 

[whitegold]

To me it sounds like your dealer is barking up the right tree!! Good luck with your purchase and have fun.

If you and your other half are planning on spending much time in the mountains you might consider taking an avalanche course...

 

[szprod]

To me it sounds like your dealer is barking up the right tree!! Good luck with your purchase and have fun.

If you and your other half are planning on spending much time in the mountains you might consider taking an avalanche course...

I would for sure take a avalanche course and ride trials until I buy everything needed for mountain riding.

Whats all involved with summarizing a sled? like after the season is over do you just drain the oil and gas and put the sled away for the summer or is there more to it?

 

[teamgreen]

Go over to Martin Motorsports and see Trent, tell him I sent you.

 

[mach123]

Go over to Riverside and see pierre there, tell him Darren sent you. Good luck

 

[kenvb]

not sure if a 800 is right for you, those new 600 bombies are best on fuel of all on market.maybe see if you can rent one first.might be able to from the Alberta beach dealer, or at least try one out there.
Ithought I would like the idea of the 500 Yamaha Phazer, but no wind protection for this ole fart.so stuck to conventional sit down Polaris with talll windshield .

I have been sledding since 1967,,, have owned many new sleds, this last 800 Polaris is way to big for me, like to go down to a 600.

 

[whitegold]

I would for sure take a avalanche course and ride trials until I buy everything needed for mountain riding.

Whats all involved with summarizing a sled? like after the season is over do you just drain the oil and gas and put the sled away for the summer or is there more to it?

Different people do different things to their sled before they put it away for the summer. If you get a 2 stroke then you shouldn't need to drain the oil, but I do take out most of the gas and put a stabilizer in what is left. I also give it a good cleaning.... including under the hood! I look for any wearing parts... hoses etc. Some people fog them... I don't.... I just run it for a few minutes every 4 - 6 weeks over the summer to keep the insides lubricated. I also put a board under the track on edge to get the track off the ground, as well as put the scratchers down. I usually like to start the next season with new spark plugs, but you can do this in the fall if you like.

I can't think of anything else now.... but I'm sure I've missed some stuff.... anyone else???

 

[maxwell]

if you buy the new skidoo etec it has push button summarization which runs the injection pump wide open for a few minutes. when its done summerizing itself it will shutoff then you dont touch it until next season.

either way you know my opinion. summit 154. you will be extremely dissapointed in the performance of the backcountry renegade once you get into the steep and deep and a 2up seat can be added. like teamgreen said go see trent at mms

 

[szprod]

Thanks for the feedback everyone. I now have a better idea of what I'm looking for.

 

[underdog]

I agree with maxwell. Summit 154. I really like my 800 ETEC, and I get better fuel consumtion than my buddy who has the same sled but with the PTEC engine. For comparision, we went to Revelstoke, and rode for a day, each doing the same climbs and everything, and we ride exactly the same. Filled gas the next morning and he paid $31, while I paid $20.

 

[2003Summit]

I also think the dealer suggestion is right.

A renegade is a cross over sled, which is a mix of trail, and off trial riding. The back-country has wider skis and a bit more aggressive track, very important to you if you will ride the mountains. I would get a 146" track on it if you can though, 137" is a bit too light for the hills. The track is expensive to change later, but it can be done. See if the dealer can offer you a 146" track new - even if its going to cost more, it will be less expensive if you start this way. If it comes down to it though, the 137" will still take you around in the mountains, your just going to have to be a bit more careful with it.

I wouldn't look at a 600 if you are going the mountains. You will need 800 power. There is really no draw back to the 800 Etec other than the extra cost. The new Etec are fantastic. The have exceptional fuel economy, are extreamly well mannered and because of how clean they run I think they will prove to be more reliable. If you are not familiar with the Etec, this is 20+ year old evenrude technology that kept the outboards in 2 stroke all these years. Proven and solid.

Again, don't get a 600, you will regret it in the powderer - it takes a lot of power to move large volumes of snow and everyone else you go with will have an 800 and if you don't it will be more challenging for you to ride with them. More stuck, more frustration, less happy.

DO NOT get a 4 stoke if you want to ride in the powder. Serous mistake. They are way too heavy and unless you mod them they are seriously underpowered for deep snow and the extra weight. Also the heavy sled ends up going where it wants and not where you need it to. This is very bad for a beginner in the hills. Again the Etec is so clean, its not necessary to consider 4 stroke. By the way, 800 2 stroke is almost exactly the same weight as a 600, so if you think a 600 will be lighter, it really wont be.

Just for your own FYI: The renegade back country is actually fairly close to a summit (pure mountain sled). A GSX is a pure trial sled, it would be pretty hard to ride GSX in powder at all, the Renegade tries to be at neither extreme allowing you to function both on the trail and off, the main differences are (between Renegade and summit):

the size of the top gear (renegade will be 23 to 25 teeth, summit 19 teeth, smaller top gear is more torque on the track and easier on the belt, larger top gear is lower RPM on the trail and quieter).
Different ramps in the clutch, for lower RPM on the trail, a little later to down shift in the pow but still acceptable.
Coupled suspension which make it way nicer to ride on the trail!
Shocks a little more suited to trail riding
Slightly wider ski stance
Lower riser on the handle bars

You can essentially convert the renegade to summit by changing the top gear, changing the ramps and springs in the clutch and getting a taller riser. A non couple suspension would climb slightly better in the pow but I know a lot of guys that would rater have a couple suspension in the summit for the trail ride up and down to the pow.
The shocks in a renegade are not going to be up to serous pounding (jumping) like the summit, but unless you are doing that, it's not going to matter much.

If you going to make changes to the renegade for better powderer riding, the first thing would be the taller riser, then the top gear, then the clutch.

The nice thing with the renegade is your bases are covered for what you said you want.

 

[szprod]

All that info is good to know. I figured I would want a 800 because besides just the mountains a 600 with a passenger isn't going to have enough power. I have had 5 guys now say get a 800 you will regret it if you don't. I don't want to make a bunch of mods to the sled because the upfront cost is already a lot lol. So Summit would probably be best. I hear you on the couple suspension but you can't miss what you don't have/never tried. I have awhile until I get the sled anyhow but I will dig deep into learning as much as possible so I don't blow 16k and then find out I need something else lol.

 

[talkinghamster]

All that info is good to know. I figured I would want a 800 because besides just the mountains a 600 with a passenger isn't going to have enough power. I have had 5 guys now say get a 800 you will regret it if you don't. I don't want to make a bunch of mods to the sled because the upfront cost is already a lot lol. So Summit would probably be best. I hear you on the couple suspension but you can't miss what you don't have/never tried. I have awhile until I get the sled anyhow but I will dig deep into learning as much as possible so I don't blow 16k and then find out I need something else lol.

what about a summit 146? my dad has a 154 summit and its a pain in the @$$ on trails...

 

[maxwell]

yes a summit 146 is an option i just cant tell you how many of my friends were P^&*(*^& off when we had to extend there sleds to 163 at a cost of 2000$. why didnt i just buy it in the first place?

im just curious as to why the extra few inches in length makes it a pain in the azz on the trails compared to the 146?

 

[szprod]

Well how I was thinking is just the same as no less than a 800 because I will have a passenger.. would it not make sense if I have a passenger on the trails or in the mountains to have a longer tack length so the track covers more surface area which should distribute the weight of both riders? That why I think 137 is to short and 154 might be right. I just want to make sure I can have 2 people on the sled in both situations mountains or trials. My other half won't be happy if I go to the mountains and she wants to come and I say sorry we have to take turns on the sled because it will sink otherwise lol... but then again I dont have the exp you guys do so maybe my thinking is wrong haha

 

[maxwell]

to be honest a 137 wont even push you around in the mountains. your thinking is correct

 

[Big kid 33]

i run my 154 0n the trails it is great all around sled

 

[Bnorth]

a 154 is more than manageable on the trails. I'm a new rider and have no trouble on trails with my 162. After riding a 162 I will never buy anything with a shorter track. A 137 with a second person on the back will just sink as soon as you get into the powder. In powder you need flotation, especially with a passenger.

 

[hihi962]

by the sounds of it, it still seems like the 800 cross over sled is the one for you, trust your dealer, it's his job.
not much use in you getting a summit as you will be with the wifey most of the time by the sounds of it, I think your idea of mountain riding is different then what some guys here are thinking. I am pretty sure you are not doing hill climbs with the wife on the back, nor are you beating out cut blocks all day long. to me it sounds like you do a fair amount of trail riding (in and out of the mountains), nice scenic rides with the odd pull and the odd boondock. am I right?
if this is the case, the crossover should suit your needs as it is fairly well rounded for that. remember a 1 3/4" track can still handle a fair amount of snow... you're not going to get stuck all over the place, and a 154 has no problem on the trails, but a 137 is not exacly going to leave you dead in the snow, just can't handle those socked in days and can't really do the big long deep pulls. IMO.

 

[maxwell]

the dealer is just excited because someone is finally looking at that pos renegade no one wants. jk...