2018 Skidoo Summit Mechanical Changes.

[Merc63]

2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

This thread is to list Mechanical Changes to the 2018 Summit.

There is a video on skidoos Facebook page. I'm watching now and will list changes I hear.

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

This is straight from the engineer at Skidoo on the FB video.

Bulkhead:

Added metal in casting and reinforcement plates. The plates can be purchased and added to 2017 models, if you think you're going to be hitting fixed objects.

Clutching and Belt:

More air flow and redesign to allow more movement of air through cvt area. New belt for 2018 and fan like fins added to spin more air around.

 

[Merc63]

Moral of the story, 2017 buyers are left out to hang, thanks Skidoo.

 

[b_doornenbal]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

Do you have the link to the vid ??

 

[Merc63]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

I tried to but couldn't copy it. Skidoo on FB, scroll down a bit, under the Live video.

 

[b_doornenbal]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

was it the q&a with all the riders ?

 

[Summit 934]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

was it the q&a with all the riders ?

Yes after the riders they talk with Ski Doo reps on the mechanical problems.

 

[Lund]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

This is straight from the engineer at Skidoo on the FB video.

Bulkhead:

Added metal in casting and reinforcement plates. The plates can be purchased and added to 2017 models, if you think you're going to be hitting fixed objects.

Clutching and Belt:

More air flow and redesign to allow more movement of air through cvt area. New belt for 2018 and fan like fins added to spin more air around.

At the beginning when G4 were breaking i said that the casting was too brittle because of lack of metal mixture in the casting. Now that they changed the composition for the 18 model's they knew it was a problem. The problem is if you have the 17 with the brittle casting, installing the bracing (reinforcement plate)is a bandaid now. It will not hold up and maybe buy you a bit of time before it cracks around the bracing. The only real fix is to replace the entire casting with the updated 18 one.

 

[Lund]

Moral of the story, 2017 buyers are left out to hang, thanks Skidoo.

The moral of the story is BRP will still have their hands in your pocket for 2018. It's all ready started, look at how many threads are on here for the 18's LOL
Some are hooked like a bad drug, drooling over them.

 

[tex78]

The moral of the story is BRP will still have their hands in your pocket for 2018. It's all ready started, look at how many threads are on here for the 18's LOL
Some are hooked like a bad drug, drooling over them.

About the same as you with da yamisqua right

Apples to apple's

sent while drinking tea's

 

[roadlinur113]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

At the beginning when G4 were breaking i said that the casting was too brittle because of lack of metal mixture in the casting. Now that they changed the composition for the 18 model's they knew it was a problem. The problem is if you have the 17 with the brittle casting, installing the bracing (reinforcement plate)is a bandaid now. It will not hold up and maybe buy you a bit of time before it cracks around the bracing. The only real fix is to replace the entire casting with the updated 18 one.

As a certified NDT Level II technician with 25 years experience I am curious as to your evaluation method to lead you to the conclusion of the metal mixture in 2017 Bulkheads? The last test I read you performed on a 2014 and 2016 Viper rod with a ball peen hammer in your garage while drinking beer....pretty scientific for sure. How did the hardness of those rods compare on say the Rockwell C Chart? Perhaps there will be an employment opportunity in my company for someone with your vast knowledge.

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

As a certified NDT Level II technician with 25 years experience I am curious as to your evaluation method to lead you to the conclusion of the metal mixture in 2017 Bulkheads? The last test I read you performed on a 2014 and 2016 Viper rod with a ball peen hammer in your garage while drinking beer....pretty scientific for sure. How did the hardness of those rods compare on say the Rockwell C Chart? Perhaps there will be an employment opportunity in my company for someone with your vast knowledge.

Hey I am curious what you think of the metal choice in the G4 bulkheads.

And from the pictures of the failures you have seen what can you conclude?

 

[norona]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

At the beginning when G4 were breaking i said that the casting was too brittle because of lack of metal mixture in the casting. Now that they changed the composition for the 18 model's they knew it was a problem. The problem is if you have the 17 with the brittle casting, installing the bracing (reinforcement plate)is a bandaid now. It will not hold up and maybe buy you a bit of time before it cracks around the bracing. The only real fix is to replace the entire casting with the updated 18 one.

Not true, not worth explaining the answer as someone who is negative will just turn it around. Watch the live feed with engineers and they can explain it. The material is not brittle nor is the material mixture wrong, it took a while to figure it out as when it is not warranty they don't get parts to see and reverse engineer to figure it out, you have to hit something, it turns out that at a 15-30 degree hit to spindle there was a huge pressure point put on bulk head and it cracked, you have to hit something though. If nothing else is damaged and there is proof of that brp is working with the customer to get it fixed, there were less than 60 bulk heads breaking and less than a third of these cases, there are as many cases where guys hit something very hard and damaged skis, suspension, a-arms and bulkhead is fine, you can believe what you want but most of you guys are wallowing in your own thoughts just to make you right, that is fine, but all your doing is making others think there is a major problem. They have tested huge hits now in that 15-30 degree range off the spindle and the brace fixes the issue, it does not crack around it(fact), so you can purchase the brace for 55.00 canadian and instal it or have dealer do it and your all good if you hit something in that way, the improvements in the bulk head overall with adding material is a rolling improvement and happens every year with a change of things like wireing, bolts, different placements of stuff and many other things since they have more time to work through things. so yes the machine is improving every month through the year, would you rather it not, it is why the 2016 xm is much better than the 2013. I have never stated there are not issues but I know a lot of the numbers and with the amount of sleds and problems it is well below 1% (if you are having a problem I am not making light of the fact, I will try and your dealer will try to make it better)however I agree with the engineers that 1 problem is one too many and that is why they are constantly working on stuff, there not on the internet all day while at work saying how they can design something way better than the people who design for the company. Get out and ride and have fun, it is what the sport is all about. Your posts and the one below it are just your opinion, that is not accurate by the way and your trying to be right. You don't know numbers, you did not design, build or instal the bulkhead or any other parts, your just throwing it out there to make your self sound like you know what your talking about, this is exactly why you don't get the answers you seek. If I came into your job and told you you were an idiot, said your work is pathetic and you have no idea what you are doing and dreamed up a few other things that were totally wrong, would you then give me the time to answer questions i have? Probably not. My job is not to convince you to buy a sled or convince you that there is not any issues or never will be issues or that the issues are so small that ski doo or myself dont care, it is to put the facts out there, you get to choose what to do with them, but mostly what I see is guys have convinced themselves of only their way is right, Nothing needs to be done to the bulkhead in 2017, however if you think you might hit something, then the brace is there to purchase...just like the bracing from any other company, which is way more money and actually will transfer the hit to somewhere else. Its your choice. Enjoy your sleds , it is what I and a ton of customers have been doing...

 

[roadlinur113]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

Hey I am curious what you think of the metal choice in the G4 bulkheads.

And from the pictures of the failures you have seen what can you conclude?

I have not examined a failed bulkhead in person nor seen the lab metallurgy results so not possible to give an actual EDUCATED opinion on composition unfortunately.

As far as looking at the failures from pictures I would try not to hit solid objects ( I understand nobody sets out to hit anything). BRP will beef up the high stress areas and brace as they said in their videos and I wouldn't be surprised if an updated (read weaker) A arm and sway bar combination is implemented.

I realize this doesn't answer your questions much but without the imperical data one gathers from doing a Destructive Test which is to apply enough stress to cause metal deformation or failure it would be pure speculation on my part. Leave that to the armchair Engineers that this site has in abundance.

 

[Summitric]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

Less than 1% and of that 1%(60 total) and of that, the majority hit something.......
Definatley acceptable unless you're in that .75% that hit something

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

Less than 1% and of that 1%(60 total) and of that, the majority hit something.......
Definatley acceptable unless you're in that .75% that hit something

Have you ever hit anything with a sled where you didn't total the bulk head?

Or do you expect to replace a bulk head everytime you hit something?

 

[Summitric]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

have you ever hit anything with a sled where you didn't total the bulk head?

Or do you expect to replace a bulk head everytime you hit something?

i have, and i wrote off a sled or two.... Have you?
I have a xm now, and have hit plenty...
If i had a g4, i'd be putting the $55 brace in it, just to give you peace of mind

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

i have, and i wrote off a sled or two.... Have you?
I have a xm now, and have hit plenty...
If i had a g4, i'd be putting the $55 brace in it, just to give you peace of mind

Haha yes but they were epic endings to the sleds life. And 100% my fault.

I have hit things with my XM that's have stopped the sled dead and sent me flying 10-15 ft infront of the sled.

Broke skis, but knock on wood never an a arm, bulkhead or a s mod.

I want peace of mind before I upgrade to the G4.

Might mean sitting on the sideline for another year to watch more test pilots.

 

[skegpro]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

At the beginning when G4 were breaking i said that the casting was too brittle because of lack of metal mixture in the casting. Now that they changed the composition for the 18 model's they knew it was a problem. The problem is if you have the 17 with the brittle casting, installing the bracing (reinforcement plate)is a bandaid now. It will not hold up and maybe buy you a bit of time before it cracks around the bracing. The only real fix is to replace the entire casting with the updated 18 one.

Where does one find info on the updated bulkhead like casting composition changes?

 

[roadlinur113]

Re: 2018 Skidoo Summit G4 850 Mechanical Changes.

Where does one find info on the updated bulkhead like casting composition changes?

If it was me I would attend a release event at a local dealer and ask the BRP reps on hand the hardball questions. Make sure they know if you don't get the satisfactory answers to your concerns that you and many other potential buyers will look elsewhere. And yes I am a big Doo fan because I like their innovations (some great others not so much but they strive to improve) and in the recent past they have came to the party on big issues like the etec piston recall and proactively did the necessary updates instead of waiting for engine failures to actually happen then repair(lost riding time)