Grooming 101 for Whiners

Shermanator

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So, I'll try and keep this short but bear with me at times as I rant. There have been some complainers on certain sites, whining about the condition of the groomed trails up to Owlshead and Blue Lake. For those not in the loop, they're looked after by the Eagle Valley Snowmobile Club in Sicamous. Quick history lesson, when I started sledding in this area in 2008 the Club was hooped, but was brought back to life by Bruce Moores who took over the grooming aspect and now Gord Bushell who has kept up with the excellent program.

I went up the trail this AM for a test, and a ride, to see WTF the problem is. Looking at the Club website, it was just groomed last night (3rd). The Club has a policy of trying to groom at night so the trail will "set up" for the following day. Me, being the first one on the trail, it was like a paved hwy. Now with that said, the first 1.5 km was rougher, but for those who know anything about the snow cat that does the work, it has metal cleats on its rubber tracks, these cleats are also known as grousers. I don't know if anyone but me noticed (being the retired groomer I am) but the track cleats were digging up dirt in that first km and change, because there is not enough snow, hello! Again, for anyone who pays attention, you'd notice that as you get higher up, you get more snow, duh, and the trail is groomed right flat because of this. I took the trail all the way to Blue Lk, flat as a pancake and in fact I went "off trail" a few times to grab a little extra snow! Which brings up another point, there isn't always a 4 lane hwy up the trails, there are spots that the groomer will only do a single lane, leaving some of this "off trail" snow so you can go and grab a little extra snow sometimes, how's that for courteous!

Now comes my point, finally, I did my quicky trip up around Blue and down to Cummings Lake and back down the trail, I passed only 8 sleds between Blue and the Owl's turnoff. The trail was in "like new" shape the entire way to this turnoff, pretty simple to tell no one was dicking around and ripping the new fricking snow up. Oh ya, did you know that snow is in fact soft and can be ripped up by morons that pin their throttle open, on and off, ya, that happens. Anyways, at the Owls's turnoff there had to be 20 machines, including quite a few snow bikes. As I went past them the first thing I noticed is that the trail was already getting rougher than when I came up, corners blown out in some areas and other areas skinned right flat and shiny. With that said, 3 snow bikes went by me, one with a rooster tail that looked like something out of a jet boat! Further down the trail were another 15 or so machines, and the trail got rougher yet, to the point where unless you had a SkiDoo XM you would have had to stand up! Near the bottom but especially that last 2 km it was brutal, duh!

Unc Gord and the trail pass gal just happened to be at the bottom of the hill when I got down, and I asked how many sleds had gone up. The number was 58. And you whiners wonder why after a 100 sleds the trail is rough??? Really? What the hell do you expect, especially when you get morons tearing the crap out of a newly groomed trail! Sure, we all want to have fun but don't go blasting the Club with your BS about wanting a refund or that they're expected to groom just when you decide to get your sorry ass outta bed at noon, give it a break! You say you "won't come back there" well, as far as I'm concerned that's great, at least our trails will stay in better shape! For you that say "well if it weren't for us Albertan's your town wouldn't exist", you can go find another hill too, because those Albertan's that truly support the town and Club don't have anything that even resembles that moronic attitude. Unc Gord is going to be posting a "for real" Grooming 101 that explains just what's going on with the groomer and the drag when they do the trails, maybe the whiners should give it a read in-between their complaining and paying for our town! Hats off to the EVS Club, the grooming guys (Glenn, Ken and Gord), Unc Gord and all those others that work/volunteer with the Club for running a class act, keep up the great work....... Sherm
 

rightsideup

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So, I'll try and keep this short but bear with me at times as I rant. There have been some complainers on certain sites, whining about the condition of the groomed trails up to Owlshead and Blue Lake. For those not in the loop, they're looked after by the Eagle Valley Snowmobile Club in Sicamous. Quick history lesson, when I started sledding in this area in 2008 the Club was hooped, but was brought back to life by Bruce Moores who took over the grooming aspect and now Gord Bushell who has kept up with the excellent program.

I went up the trail this AM for a test, and a ride, to see WTF the problem is. Looking at the Club website, it was just groomed last night (3rd). The Club has a policy of trying to groom at night so the trail will "set up" for the following day. Me, being the first one on the trail, it was like a paved hwy. Now with that said, the first 1.5 km was rougher, but for those who know anything about the snow cat that does the work, it has metal cleats on its rubber tracks, these cleats are also known as grousers. I don't know if anyone but me noticed (being the retired groomer I am) but the track cleats were digging up dirt in that first km and change, because there is not enough snow, hello! Again, for anyone who pays attention, you'd notice that as you get higher up, you get more snow, duh, and the trail is groomed right flat because of this. I took the trail all the way to Blue Lk, flat as a pancake and in fact I went "off trail" a few times to grab a little extra snow! Which brings up another point, there isn't always a 4 lane hwy up the trails, there are spots that the groomer will only do a single lane, leaving some of this "off trail" snow so you can go and grab a little extra snow sometimes, how's that for courteous!

Now comes my point, finally, I did my quicky trip up around Blue and down to Cummings Lake and back down the trail, I passed only 8 sleds between Blue and the Owl's turnoff. The trail was in "like new" shape the entire way to this turnoff, pretty simple to tell no one was dicking around and ripping the new fricking snow up. Oh ya, did you know that snow is in fact soft and can be ripped up by morons that pin their throttle open, on and off, ya, that happens. Anyways, at the Owls's turnoff there had to be 20 machines, including quite a few snow bikes. As I went past them the first thing I noticed is that the trail was already getting rougher than when I came up, corners blown out in some areas and other areas skinned right flat and shiny. With that said, 3 snow bikes went by me, one with a rooster tail that looked like something out of a jet boat! Further down the trail were another 15 or so machines, and the trail got rougher yet, to the point where unless you had a SkiDoo XM you would have had to stand up! Near the bottom but especially that last 2 km it was brutal, duh!

Unc Gord and the trail pass gal just happened to be at the bottom of the hill when I got down, and I asked how many sleds had gone up. The number was 58. And you whiners wonder why after a 100 sleds the trail is rough??? Really? What the hell do you expect, especially when you get morons tearing the crap out of a newly groomed trail! Sure, we all want to have fun but don't go blasting the Club with your BS about wanting a refund or that they're expected to groom just when you decide to get your sorry ass outta bed at noon, give it a break! You say you "won't come back there" well, as far as I'm concerned that's great, at least our trails will stay in better shape! For you that say "well if it weren't for us Albertan's your town wouldn't exist", you can go find another hill too, because those Albertan's that truly support the town and Club don't have anything that even resembles that moronic attitude. Unc Gord is going to be posting a "for real" Grooming 101 that explains just what's going on with the groomer and the drag when they do the trails, maybe the whiners should give it a read in-between their complaining and paying for our town! Hats off to the EVS Club, the grooming guys (Glenn, Ken and Gord), Unc Gord and all those others that work/volunteer with the Club for running a class act, keep up the great work....... Sherm
Well put there can be as many as 250 sleds on that trail in a busy day
 

ferniesnow

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From one groomer operator to another, well said. They just don't get it and won't get until they sit in the seat for countless hours and then go up the fresh groomed trail to see how they groomed. The only point I learned in Grooming 101 was a simple concept: everyone can groom better and has all the ideas on how to doo it!

On most nights, it is a thankless job and the only satisfaction is the baby-butt smooth ribbon that is left behind the drag for a few hours while Mother Nature takes over and maybe freezes so that the groomed trail will last for 75-100 sleds.
 

moyiesledhead

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Every sledder should have to ride his sled up the trail and back in the middle of the night in a snowstorm at 8mph at least once. There'd be a lot less whining. :rolleyes:
 

imdoo'n

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So, I'll try and keep this short but bear with me at times as I rant. There have been some complainers on certain sites, whining about the condition of the groomed trails up to Owlshead and Blue Lake. For those not in the loop, they're looked after by the Eagle Valley Snowmobile Club in Sicamous. Quick history lesson, when I started sledding in this area in 2008 the Club was hooped, but was brought back to life by Bruce Moores who took over the grooming aspect and now Gord Bushell who has kept up with the excellent program.

I went up the trail this AM for a test, and a ride, to see WTF the problem is. Looking at the Club website, it was just groomed last night (3rd). The Club has a policy of trying to groom at night so the trail will "set up" for the following day. Me, being the first one on the trail, it was like a paved hwy. Now with that said, the first 1.5 km was rougher, but for those who know anything about the snow cat that does the work, it has metal cleats on its rubber tracks, these cleats are also known as grousers. I don't know if anyone but me noticed (being the retired groomer I am) but the track cleats were digging up dirt in that first km and change, because there is not enough snow, hello! Again, for anyone who pays attention, you'd notice that as you get higher up, you get more snow, duh, and the trail is groomed right flat because of this. I took the trail all the way to Blue Lk, flat as a pancake and in fact I went "off trail" a few times to grab a little extra snow! Which brings up another point, there isn't always a 4 lane hwy up the trails, there are spots that the groomer will only do a single lane, leaving some of this "off trail" snow so you can go and grab a little extra snow sometimes, how's that for courteous!

Now comes my point, finally, I did my quicky trip up around Blue and down to Cummings Lake and back down the trail, I passed only 8 sleds between Blue and the Owl's turnoff. The trail was in "like new" shape the entire way to this turnoff, pretty simple to tell no one was dicking around and ripping the new fricking snow up. Oh ya, did you know that snow is in fact soft and can be ripped up by morons that pin their throttle open, on and off, ya, that happens. Anyways, at the Owls's turnoff there had to be 20 machines, including quite a few snow bikes. As I went past them the first thing I noticed is that the trail was already getting rougher than when I came up, corners blown out in some areas and other areas skinned right flat and shiny. With that said, 3 snow bikes went by me, one with a rooster tail that looked like something out of a jet boat! Further down the trail were another 15 or so machines, and the trail got rougher yet, to the point where unless you had a SkiDoo XM you would have had to stand up! Near the bottom but especially that last 2 km it was brutal, duh!

Unc Gord and the trail pass gal just happened to be at the bottom of the hill when I got down, and I asked how many sleds had gone up. The number was 58. And you whiners wonder why after a 100 sleds the trail is rough??? Really? What the hell do you expect, especially when you get morons tearing the crap out of a newly groomed trail! Sure, we all want to have fun but don't go blasting the Club with your BS about wanting a refund or that they're expected to groom just when you decide to get your sorry ass outta bed at noon, give it a break! You say you "won't come back there" well, as far as I'm concerned that's great, at least our trails will stay in better shape! For you that say "well if it weren't for us Albertan's your town wouldn't exist", you can go find another hill too, because those Albertan's that truly support the town and Club don't have anything that even resembles that moronic attitude. Unc Gord is going to be posting a "for real" Grooming 101 that explains just what's going on with the groomer and the drag when they do the trails, maybe the whiners should give it a read in-between their complaining and paying for our town! Hats off to the EVS Club, the grooming guys (Glenn, Ken and Gord), Unc Gord and all those others that work/volunteer with the Club for running a class act, keep up the great work....... Sherm

so i guess all these guys rippin It up where from out of town? or no locals ever complain. weird eh!
 

kimrick

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Glad you kept it short Sherm.Lol!
Tha azz hats that do the complaining or throttle ripping cant read though!

Well done to the club and BIG THANKS for all the work and volunteer hours.......
The Thanks go to all club volunteers for all the snowmobile clubs in North America.

As SNOPRO often states, We are own worst enemies.

Please dont get to disgruntled. We need more volunteers like yourself and all other volunteers.
Well done again and Kudos...
 

MADMAN

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Wish I lived in the area as I would absolutely LOVE to help out, everything about the Mountains I absolutely LOVE! Seriously Great job guys/ladies and thanks for it all!
 

Marley

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For the groomers that are whining - as soon as there is one bump the rest of them self perpetuate - as much as I don't like the the trail racers, the bumps happen when the suspension loads and un-loads even when on an even throttle. I know, I'm a doctor...
 

LBZ

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so i guess all these guys rippin It up where from out of town? or no locals ever complain. weird eh!
I'm sure it's both doing the damage, and complaining. But I get what your saying......

What I hate the most though is the impatient arseholes that not only bend it out sideways and wash out the corners but cut to the inside on every corner risking a collision and then scream past you throwing chunks at you cuz they need to get to the cabin 2 min ahead of you. In fact, most times these same dicks will sit their for quite sometime waiting for other buddies. So they just tore up the groomed trail for nothing. Makes one want to throw hammers!!
 

Shermanator

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Its not the groomers that are whining, its the sledders. Funny thing though as I mentionend, those 8 that were on the Blue Lk trail after I was on it never left so much as a dent in the trail, I'm guessing they were riding more like my "old man" style than tearing the crap outta the trail like the others were, I know, I'm a fisherman....Sherm

For the groomers that are whining - as soon as there is one bump the rest of them self perpetuate - as much as I don't like the the trail racers, the bumps happen when the suspension loads and un-loads even when on an even throttle. I know, I'm a doctor...
 

imdoo'n

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trail grooming is one of those jobs where you hardly hear anything when tails are good, but get an earful when they suck. but sorry boys that's life, try being a ref or umpire. lol,

please fill in report. j/k , you do the best you can do with what you have. for what it is worth ,


i thank you for what you have done, are doing, and hopefully continue to do.
 

revbyu

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Having been riding up owls trails since Jan 1st ! Have no complaints with the trail ! has been in decent for the amount of sleds that have been using it and with the little snow that has fallen the groomers have been doing a great job ! Some sledders have no considerations for the others sledders behind them ! full throttle around every corner ! Do they get there any faster !?? Passing in tight corners must make them feel like heros ! In there own mind I guess ! My 2 cents ! Hats off the the Club ! Keep up the great work !!!
 

Dooitorbust

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As an Albertan originally from BC, thank you for taking the time to maintain and groom the trails, weather you're paid or a volunteer. I don't get to ride a mint trail very often but when I do I sure appreciate it. Especially after a day of hard riding. Thanks again.
 

catinthehat

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I'm sure it's both doing the damage, and complaining. But I get what your saying......

What I hate the most though is the impatient arseholes that not only bend it out sideways and wash out the corners but cut to the inside on every corner risking a collision and then scream past you throwing chunks at you cuz they need to get to the cabin 2 min ahead of you. In fact, most times these same dicks will sit their for quite sometime waiting for other buddies. So they just tore up the groomed trail for nothing. Makes one want to throw hammers!!
You obviously don't understand, that gives them time for one more beer than the slowpokes. Nobody wants to carry the extra weight of full beer cans any longer than they have too.
 

snopro

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There seems to be a feeling with some guys that because they paid there $20-$25 bucks to ride a groomed trail they have the right to do to that trail whatever they feel they want to. I think if we all learned to cool it when on the trail there would be better trails overall and a lot less close calls out there. Old Mother Nature gave us tons of fresh deep pow on acres after acres after acres of crown land up top but we gotta give the trail a work out so we can complain about it? The groomer operators and clubs do a fantastic job considering the cards they are dealt (2.5-3 inch tracks on modded mountain sleds) Like Sherm said....cool it on the trail, climb out of bed before noon and quit the crying. First new year rant for me! HaHa!
 

tex78

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Its not the groomers that are whining, its the sledders. Funny thing though as I mentionend, those 8 that were on the Blue Lk trail after I was on it never left so much as a dent in the trail, I'm guessing they were riding more like my "old man" style than tearing the crap outta the trail like the others were, I know, I'm a fisherman....Sherm
We were in the group of 5 out of 8.... Going a good clip but not ramathorn the trail



There's lots of outatowners that live in town, they don't complain


Let them complain , no where this year has had a good trail with 100 plus sleds a day, mother nature hasn't helped one bit


Having said that, it's snowing like a mofo and trail should be good tomorrow
 
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