Kanedog discovers a Clutching CATastrophy, again. Pics!

kanedog · Nov 13, 2019

Bnorth said:
I think you need to switch strains. All of these parts are isolated from each other. Engine is on rubber mounts, TCL has isolators, and the rail is literally supported on shocks from the chassis.

Incorrect. The TCL is attached to the bearing housing and jackshaft bearing which is on the jackshaft. On the chaincase side, the jackshaft bearing mount is solid to the chaincase. The chaincase is directly connected to the frame. It forms a structural part of the chassis. There is no rubber mounts in the bearing housing or chaincase. Metal to metal bud. It’s like they rubber mounted 5 points to isolate the engine but forgot the sixth place. Did they just forget about it? How could they miss it? By leaving one of the 6th motor/frame solid to the motor, this cancels out the first five. The harmonics are making it thru the chaincase and spreading. Engineering mistake.

Harmonics travel through bearings. If there are more than a few bearing failures, this will cement the harmonics theory. Bearings are like chocolate cake to harmonics. It eats them up like crazy.

Do you know of a reason the glue would be releasing? I’m not being sarcastic or smart ass at all. I just can’t think of a reason why the glue would lose its bond.

Hey Bnorth, you know what’s funny? I wrote this post being ripped for the first time in two weeks and not a lot before that. Do you know what would be even funnier? ...............If I was right. Bahahahahahahaha

kanedog · Nov 13, 2019

lilduke said:
think bnorth might be right. I think it's just mass produced junk that falls apart like all mass produced junk does.

I tried to make that argument with myself. I saw there was just too many failures at stress points. Think of the secondary clutch bolt and how tight it is. The secondary clutch bolt didn’t back out because it was a cheap bolt. The tunnel didn’t crack at the chaincase because it was a cheap tunnel and the frame bolts didn’t back out because of being cheap. Just to many other odd things going on.

Bnorth · Nov 13, 2019

kanedog said:
Incorrect. The TCL is attached to the bearing housing and jackshaft bearing which is on the jackshaft. On the chaincase side, the jackshaft bearing mount is solid to the chassis. The mount is directly connected to the frame. There is no rubber in the jackshaft bearings or bearing supposed. Metal to metal bud.

Harmonics travel through bearings. If there are more than a few bearing failures, this will cement the harmonics theory. Bearings are like chocolate cake to harmonics. It eats them up like crazy.

Do you know of a reason the glue would be releasing? I’m not being sarcastic or smart ass at all. I just can’t think of a reason why the glue would lose its bond.

Hey Bnorth, you know what’s funny? I wrote this post being ripped for the first time in two weeks and not a lot before that. Do you know what would be even funnier? ...............If I was right. Bahahahahahahaha

The TCL is isolated from the motor not the chassis. The glue released because of poor QC unless you would like to present Polaris Pro A-arms had glue failure due to harmonics as well?

Now to be clear I'm not saying there isn't a harmonics issue, most 800 twins have them as they are inherently a poorly balanced engine configuration. What I am saying is you're looking for a smoking gun to explain every issue. Glue fails, aluminum fatigues, snowmobiles are junk. It wouldn't be the 1st sled that had a non harmonic induced failure near the front of the tunnels. Poo's folded there for years. Why does a TRA primary need a rebuild every 1000km? Harmonics, chit parts, and hard use literally the definition of a snowmobile.

kanedog · Nov 13, 2019

Bnorth said:
The TCL is isolated from the motor not the chassis. The glue released because of poor QC unless you would like to present Polaris Pro A-arms had glue failure due to harmonics as well?

Now to be clear I'm not saying there isn't a harmonics issue, most 800 twins have them as they are inherently a poorly balanced engine configuration. What I am saying is you're looking for a smoking gun to explain every issue. Glue fails, aluminum fatigues, snowmobiles are junk. It wouldn't be the 1st sled that had a non harmonic induced failure near the front of the tunnels. Poo's folded there for years. Why does a TRA primary need a rebuild every 1000km? Harmonics, chit parts, and hard use literally the definition of a snowmobile.

Brand new sled chassis and power transmission components don’t fail “just because.” There is a reason this stuff is happening. If it were the odd thing breaking, then yes, it just happens. But these are the same failures at the same key locations. These key locations are paramount to the strength of the chassis. The primary is the drive system. If it fails, you lose control of the vehicle. Think about your truck losing it transmission. Imagine if your sled primary exploded as you were side hilling above a 30’ drop off. Imagine the clutch letting go at just the right time so you and the sled tumble over the rock face. What about above a huge tree well. In tree riding it could take your buddy a long time to find you.

These failures are often passed off as “it just happens to sleds.” This is such a bad way to cover up safety issues. On brand new sleds, most of the time, it’s the factories fault.

Funny you mention the Skidoo clutch Harmonic balancer. I just thought about putting Doo clutch balancer on the Cat clutch, P85 for me. It might be able to be attached to the flywheel also underneath the recoil starter ring cup. Spacers would have to be made for the recoil assembly.

I like my Alpha so I gotta figure out a way to prevent harmonics from breaking my custom chit.

Caper11 · Nov 13, 2019

I think we have a up and coming vibration analyst coming into his own.

Maybe the cat engine should be pulled out and a doo engine installed. Or at least put a pdrive on it.

E-Zmoke · Nov 16, 2019

Hot off the press, another one has surfaced

acesup800 · Nov 16, 2019

That clutch looks like crap before it grenaded.

E-Zmoke · Nov 16, 2019

dgiles said:
That clutch looks like crap before it grenaded.

Yeah it sure does!! Not mine, just seen it posted online in another group

E-Zmoke · Nov 16, 2019

Couple more for you KBI

skegpro · Nov 16, 2019

Class action lawsuit time.

kanedog · Nov 16, 2019

Keep’em coming fellas! The more evidence stacked up the better.

kanedog · Nov 16, 2019

skegpro said:
Class action lawsuit time.

I’m not really sure the best approach in this sitch yet.

If someone wanted to do a class action, all the info, pics and material are right here in this thread. Heck, pick a lawyer, hand him this thread, he files a suit and off you go to court. I’m too mellow to get all riled up in a court case but I do enjoy investigating.

It’s clear Cat is blatantly avoiding a recall as they had only one clutch failure and recalled 2700 machines, recall #17-748. Currently there arevmore than one reported failure but there is no recall. Skull duggery.

It’s also clear they are using any excuse to void warranty just waiting for the 1 year warranty to expire. They can then avoid warranty and sell customers new parts and install them.

Cat had their chance at a voluntary recall and it did not fix the problems. They haven’t been transparent and did not issue a recall when the failures continued.

A voluntary recall isn’t appropriate as safety is not the #1 concern with Cat. If it were, another recall would have issued immediately by Cat. Instead, they have the gonadz to deny warranty on some clutches. It’s hilarious, well, kinda hilarious. It can only be a mandatory recall as Cat has shown they cannot be trusted.

The damage done by harmonics often can’t be seen by the naked eye. There will be hidden damage to structural pieces so this is a tough one. Recalled clutches won’t help a cracking tunnel. There’s a lot of factors that an outside agency needs to know about.

I’m curious as to how this will play out. This is really the first time on social media something like this has come to light. It’s a new situation so nobody knows how to deal with it. Cat is in pickle. They can’t deny it, the pics are posted for eternity. When consumer safety learns of this, they have no choice but to deal with it. It’s not like the old sled days when dealers could deny seeing any issues. It’s now public info. The rug has been lifted. A lotta things are under this rug. These are exciting times.

The above are my beliefs.

jpmez69 · Nov 16, 2019

kanedog said:
I’m not really sure the best approach in this sitch yet.

It’s clear Cat is blatantly avoiding a recall as they had only one clutch failure and recalled 2700 machines. There are many more than one reported failure but there is no recall. Skull duggery.

It’s also clear they are using any excuse to void warranty just waiting for the 1 year warranty to expire. They can then avoid warranty and sell customers new parts and install them.

Cat junk....Cat guys can just put on a poo clutch and be done with it...

JMCX · Nov 16, 2019

jpmez69 said:
Cat junk....Cat guys can just put on a poo clutch and be done with it...

No bearing at the bottom of a Poo primary, have to do something with the secondary. Will lose the smooth engagement of the Team clutches too.

skegpro · Nov 16, 2019

kanedog said:
I’m not really sure the best approach in this sitch yet.

It’s clear Cat is blatantly avoiding a recall as they had only one clutch failure and recalled 2700 machines. There are now many more than one reported failure but there is no recall. Skull duggery.

It’s also clear they are using any excuse to void warranty just waiting for the 1 year warranty to expire. They can then avoid warranty and sell customers new parts and install them.

Cat had their chance at a voluntary recall and it did not fix the problems. They haven’t been transparent and did not issue a recall when the failures continued.

A voluntary recall isn’t appropriate as safety is not the #1 concern. It can only be a mandatory recall as Cat has shown they cannot be trusted.

I’m curious as to how this will play out. The rug has been lifted.

The above are my beliefs.

Start by posting the pictures to their Facebook page under the comments, ask if this is normal.
You will get a response.

LMLCHEVY · Nov 16, 2019

skegpro said:
Start by posting the pictures to their Facebook page under the comments, ask if this is normal.
You will get a response. //uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/dcbe2ba8a443c090d7bcdc3e8bb4d5c8.jpg

^^^^^^^^^This

You’ll either get a response or get punted lol.
But if enough people post, there is a chance something happens.

E-Zmoke · Nov 16, 2019

skegpro said:
Start by posting the pictures to their Facebook page under the comments, ask if this is normal.
You will get a response. //uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20191117/dcbe2ba8a443c090d7bcdc3e8bb4d5c8.jpg

yes haha

kanedog · Nov 17, 2019

Snow and Mud is like the KBI file system. I’ma try to keep it all contained to this thread so all the evidence is available in one place. For those who need it, it will be right here. It took a ton of research, screenshooting and posting on this file.

Cat has a social media team and they are monitoring this thread.

If you don’t mind can you save this thread in case it gets deleted? Sanks my friends and enemies.

Bnorth · Nov 18, 2019

19 165 Alpha and have one crack on the clutch cover at the tower. Will talk to dealer and see what they say.

kanedog · Nov 18, 2019

Bnorth said:
19 165 Alpha and have one crack on the clutch cover at the tower. Will talk to dealer and see what they say.

Post up a pic of that cracka lacka cover!

Kanedog discovers a Clutching CATastrophy, again. Pics!

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