Longhairfreak
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But when I'm in the climb all my track is in the snow.
I'm not sure about you guys.
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kanedog
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Post a pic of your suspension and current hair do. Let us be the judge on how deep your penetration is. Show the mullet!
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Longhairfreak
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kanedog
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Dear Longhairfreak,
It appears that you have no angle of attack. I hereby present the award for “zero attack angle!” Nice build!
It appears that you have no angle of attack. I hereby present the award for “zero attack angle!” Nice build!
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Longhairfreak
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maxwell
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That sled Would just climb straight up. No fun for anyone that knows how to ride a sled
kanedog
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I don’t even know what to reply to this spew.
So, steep attack angles are for guys who know how to ride a sled? Good lord Maxi poo. You give good info and then BOOM! Ya wipe out all the good with one dumb comment. Kinda like myself. Haha.
Lund
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If you have a sled with an old style skid or a skid that is essentially a buck board you can benefit some from this setup, as older skids and sadly enough some new skids transfer weight poorly comparatively to others.
The problem arises with new OR long travel suspension.
In all my years of building sleds the new long travel skids with what some might consider having too much attack angle far exceed the value of the old buck board with a low attack angle.
Here is one reason, RIDE IN. This is when the weight of the rider on the sled causes the suspension to compress to a "RIDING" position, generally about 1.5-2.5" on todays newer suspension and as much as 3" on a long travel suspension. That "ride in" actually changes the attack angle, flattens it, it also keeps the track in constant contact with the snow irregular surface including in a steep climb. The older skids have very little to no "ride in", this causes the track to grip only the tops of an irregular surface and under a heavy load such as hard acceleration or on a climb can also cause the tip of the rail to "tuck up" and the track to roll or bend as it exits the drivers. This causes a track HP lost and traction lost.
There is a limit to everything and D&R's is nothing new, it was experimented with years ago by builders and there were benefits to it back then when suspensions had limited travel and virtually no "ride in".
Today the newer sleds take advantage of the improved suspensions and their benefits such as ride BUT also less drag from being overall taller from running boards to bottom of the belly. Less drag equal's easier mobility moving through deep snow and less HP to do so. IMO far exceeds old school thinking of a near flat attack angle of a D&R.
A fine example of a modern factory D&R is the A/C version, where the long travel suspension and the D&R are incorporated together in their chassis, the actual benefits are very small and the pro and con are almost 50/50. Either way Cat engineers have found a way to tap into an old idea in a newer sled and it has worked for them.
BTW notice the Cat D&R does not make the track attack flat but still has an significant angle, this allows for "RIDE IN".
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Having a shallow attack angle is like bragging about being great at the missionary position. Sledding has evolved WAY past hill climbing all day.
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Teth-Air
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That sled is "well hung"
Teth-Air
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Polaris has very little "ride in" or at least the way I set them up. You can really notice on a sled deck ramp. The Polaris sleds go up in the air at the top of the ramp while the Doo's crush the front skid shock and stay down to the deck. Not saying good or bad, just an observation to think about.
Bnorth
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Cat definitely has the flattest attack angle in the industry, I think it's a big part of why their 800 is still competitive with the 850's from the other camps.
I agree with this. My Doo used to sag off the back of the deck like a squatting dog. I would have to lever it up to get the extension under it (7' sled deck with independent extensions) and my Cat has the skid parallel to the deck after loading. Just slide the extension in and strap it down, no need to lever the rear of the skid to square it up.
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Longhairfreak
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Lund
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Ya its your setup, I do somewhat the same to amplify the weight transfer. When your actually riding your getting ride in otherwise your travel would be very limited to strictly compression. You would have to weigh like 500lbs as a rider with todays longer suspension travel to make the suspension travel its full range. Today sleds ride in about 1.5-2" as you ride, the shock valving and initial spring rate allow for that. While older suspension didn't have the travel and to prevent bottoming were relatively stiff with nearly no ride in.
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