British Columbia snowmobile federation propsal

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...kHPH-mT1pnlnkZ_bkE9RGKHkmlUp-SdvbeZnF1-CGKIiA

for your information. If you require any clarification please ask I will try to get the correct answers to you.

zal · Jun 4, 2017

A Go Fund Me page.

So...what happens when clubs vote on this and it gets denied? Or better yet, have the clubs voted on this and the results are in favour to pursue this "adventure"?

ferniesnow · Jun 4, 2017

rightsideup said:
https://l.facebook.com/l.php?u=http...kHPH-mT1pnlnkZ_bkE9RGKHkmlUp-SdvbeZnF1-CGKIiA

for your information. If you require any clarification please ask I will try to get the correct answers to you.

Why is the proposal so secretive? Where are the copies?
I am of the understanding that the new proposal is putting the big clubs against the smaller clubs. I am okay with change but not okay with having someone else paying for someone else's enjoyment. This reeks of NDPism and a free ride. How in the hell can a person expect to ride the province for $150/year??? This is like $10/day day care but we all know the money to operate has to come from somewhere. They think this low price is going to increase membership? Ya' right.......

moyiesledhead · Jun 4, 2017

zal said:
A Go Fund Me page.

So...what happens when clubs vote on this and it gets denied? Or better yet, have the clubs voted on this and the results are in favour to pursue this "adventure"?

At the spring AGM the clubs voted to proceed with hiring a consultant to finalize this plan. It was not a unanimous vote. They did NOT vote to implement it. That will be voted on once the finalized plan can be presented to them.

Our small club in Moyie has pulled out of the BCSF over this. It would ruin us financially.

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

zal said:
A Go Fund Me page.

So...what happens when clubs vote on this and it gets denied? Or better yet, have the clubs voted on this and the results are in favour to pursue this "adventure"?

the clubs voted on looking deeper into this with approximately 70 per cent wanting to look into it deeper

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

ferniesnow said:
Why is the proposal so secretive? Where are the copies?
I am of the understanding that the new proposal is putting the big clubs against the smaller clubs. I am okay with change but not okay with having someone else paying for someone else's enjoyment. This reeks of NDPism and a free ride. How in the hell can a person expect to ride the province for $150/year??? This is like $10/day day care but we all know the money to operate has to come from somewhere. They think this low price is going to increase membership? Ya' right.......

There is no proposal just a committee getting together to develop several ones that may meet the needs of all clubs.

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

moyiesledhead said:
At the spring AGM the clubs voted to proceed with hiring a consultant to finalize this plan. It was not a unanimous vote. They did NOT vote to implement it. That will be voted on once the finalized plan can be presented to them.

Our small club in Moyie has pulled out of the BCSF over this. It would ruin us financially.

I believe the clubs agreed to have a committee(i am on that committee) made up of members of Bcsf look into this but I may be incorrect. Separate issues were discussed like having a lobbyist in Victoria which has nothing to do with this proposal what so ever. This is to mitigate other concerns about keeping our area's intact.

moyiesledhead · Jun 4, 2017

rightsideup said:
I believe the clubs agreed to have a committee(i am on that committee) made up of members of Bcsf look into this but I may be incorrect.

Nope. They voted to hire a consultant to modify and finalize the existing proposal. They also voted to equally divide the cost among all 75 clubs, whether 20 members or 300 members. I already have the invoice to our club for $1700. As a small non-grooming club, we don't have $1700. That's why we pulled out. There is absolutely no regard for small clubs at the BCSF any more.

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

moyiesledhead said:
Nope. They voted to hire a consultant to modify and finalize the existing proposal. They also voted to equally divide the cost among all 75 clubs, whether 20 members or 300 members. I already have the invoice to our club for $1700. As a small non-grooming club, we don't have $1700. That's why we pulled out. There is absolutely no regard for small clubs at the BCSF any more.

Well I am on a committee of bcsf people looking into it the funding is for the costs to do the job correctly, If that has changed no one has notified me.

moyiesledhead · Jun 4, 2017

rightsideup said:
Well I am on a committee of bcsf people looking into it the funding is for the costs to do the job correctly, If that has changed no one has notified me.

Are you saying a consultant will not be hired to finalize this plan, and the committee members will be paid to do it? $1700.00 x 75 clubs = $127,500.00. Money's gotta be going somewhere. As I understand it there is one full time and one part time payed position in the BCSF. The rest is voluntary.

Edit: I stand corrected. The meeting minutes I just re-read say nothing about hiring a consultant. It was something I was told outside a meeting. The minutes only state the need for $120,000 to finalize the plan. No indication of where the money will go.

ferniesnow · Jun 4, 2017

moyiesledhead said:
................... I already have the invoice to our club for $1700. As a small non-grooming club, we don't have $1700. That's why we pulled out. There is absolutely no regard for small clubs at the BCSF any more.

That is unfathomable. $1700 even for the medium clubs is ridiculous. Most clubs are just at the break even point at the end of the season with all maintenance items eating up any left over monies.

I was quite proud of the way spending was really scrutinized prior to the amalgamation. Things were tight and decisions were made accordingly. What has changed?

moyiesledhead · Jun 4, 2017

ferniesnow said:
That is unfathomable. $1700 even for the medium clubs is ridiculous. Most clubs are just at the break even point at the end of the season with all maintenance items eating up any left over monies.

I was quite proud of the way spending was really scrutinized prior to the amalgamation. Things were tight and decisions were made accordingly. What has changed?

I have no idea what's changed. Boggles my mind. All it would have taken to satisfy a small club like ours is to make the provincial pass an optional add on to a regular club membership. If they'd done that, and apportioned the $1700 thing a little more fairly, we never would have left. Now that we're leaving the BCSF we can actually lower our yearly membership.

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

Frankly to quantify the costs it may come in a lot lower than what is being asked for. As a committee member my time will all be voluntary. As I have stated the vote to look at it 70 percent for it with a very good turnout in Valemount. Of the people representing there clubs there was a lot of passion both ways. Having attended the fall meeting north of kelowna I truely have a appreciation of your concerns.

catinthehat · Jun 4, 2017

rightsideup said:
Frankly to quantify the costs it may come in a lot lower than what is being asked for. As a committee member my time will all be voluntary. As I have stated the vote to look at it 70 percent for it with a very good turnout in Valemount. Of the people representing there clubs there was a lot of passion both ways. Having attended the fall meeting north of kelowna I truely have a appreciation of your concerns.

If the costs come in lower you can be sure the leftover money won't go back to the clubs. I wonder how many other clubs ( if any ) pulled out of the bcsf over the assessment. If it costs that much just to investigate and finalize the proposal, how much will it cost to implement it? And where do you suppose that money will come from?

rightsideup · Jun 4, 2017

catinthehat said:
If the costs come in lower you can be sure the leftover money won't go back to the clubs. I wonder how many other clubs ( if any ) pulled out of the bcsf over the assessment. If it costs that much just to investigate and finalize the proposal, how much will it cost to implement it? And where do you suppose that money will come from?

every club that voted yes will pony up which should be more than enough to get the ball rolling. To implement an acceptable plan will depend on what or if the plan is to go forward. Other funding has been approved for other functions the clubs wanted the BCSF to pursue.

Couch · Jun 5, 2017

In NL one fee covers all the province. Some areas are better maintained than others. Not without issues. A lot of passes (majority likely) are sold in the urban area but seems like much if the grooming is geared towards areas used more or less by local clubs. There's a couple of major access routes to the back country that only get an occassional look - so seems like the local clubs here still have more control / pull!

rightsideup · Jun 5, 2017

Couch said:
In NL one fee covers all the province. Some areas are better maintained than others. Not without issues. A lot of passes (majority likely) are sold in the urban area but seems like much if the grooming is geared towards areas used more or less by local clubs. There's a couple of major access routes to the back country that only get an occassional look - so seems like the local clubs here still have more control / pull!

I think if this plan goes thru and evolves correctly you will still see the established area's maintain there excellent trails and shelters while providing guidance to area'a willing to improve there's.

Got boost want snow · Jun 5, 2017

In Alberta we have the ASA it was formed to give the snowmobilers a larger voice towards the government. If a person purchases an ASA pass this covers all the trails in Alberta. ASA then divides a portion to the clubs. You can also if so desired purchase a local club membership. I know as an Albertan sledding different areas in BC it can become quite costly, a provincial trail pass would be a nice option so long as the clubs are taken care of by this governing body. Seems to work ok in Alberta.

tex78 · Jun 5, 2017

Got boost want snow said:
In Alberta we have the ASA it was formed to give the snowmobilers a larger voice towards the government. If a person purchases an ASA pass this covers all the trails in Alberta. ASA then divides a portion to the clubs. You can also if so desired purchase a local club membership. I know as an Albertan sledding different areas in BC it can become quite costly, a provincial trail pass would be a nice option so long as the clubs are taken care of by this governing body. Seems to work ok in Alberta.

There's a big difference in operation costs ( grooming being most) between any club in alberta and b.c

Also just about all trails in alberta east, are a round about TRAIL, meaning they are linked or u don't have to take the trail u came on back

Where b.c is a 10 - 30 km ( + or -) trail to the goods, which isn't even the same as anything east of in b.c

It urks me that people think of them as trails in the same way as it's a one way thing

Also the one guy that used to groom here, said it's double duty on a clubs trail here, compared to say Ontario where the same guy can go in a circle and get home only one way

Got boost want snow · Jun 5, 2017

tex78 said:
There's a big difference in operation costs ( grooming being most) between any club in alberta and b.c

Also just about all trails in alberta east, are a round about TRAIL, meaning they are linked or u don't have to take the trail u came on back

Where b.c is a 10 - 30 km ( + or -) trail to the goods, which isn't even the same as anything east of in b.c

It urks me that people think of them as trails in the same way as it's a one way thing

Also the one guy that used to groom here, said it's double duty on a clubs trail here, compared to say Ontario where the same guy can go in a circle and get home only one way

Hmmm glad to have irked you Tex our groomer doesn't make a large circle it goes 50km in then 50km out same trail and that 50km is better maintained into kakwa lake than most other trails I have rode in BC. The guy grooming in the east probably still does as many km or more as the guys in BC but yes the terrain is different. Numerous small clubs arguing with the government over closures and other issues have less effect than one large group. IE (ASA). Our local club has other income and a lot of volunteer.

British Columbia snowmobile federation propsal

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