turbo 3in or turbo 2.5

mountainsledmania

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Im already starting to plan out my next turbo build here. And ive currently got the turbo 3in already in my arsenal, but ive gotta wonder would a turbo 2.5 be better!? When you talk to guys like burandt that are big into the turbo game and the preach turbo 2.5 due to the amount of track speed it builds over a 3inch it makes me start to wonder if they are on to something here? If you stop and think about it the physics says it should work, but we all know the 3 inch out performs the 2 inch in a stock application. Im curious to hear some opinions on this, im a little bit torn over it.
 

Caper11

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Thats a interesting comment from burant, I’m not sure whats his thinking is, cause i’d prefer groundspeed, over trackspeed.
Maybe he needs the track spinning faster to do his fancy hop overs, and on camera performance in the trees. Maybe hes after a lighter weight. Im not really sure.

Ive always said the 2.5 is a perfect all around track for a variety of conditions.
 

mountainsledmania

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Thats a interesting comment from burant, I’m not sure whats his thinking is, cause i’d prefer groundspeed, over trackspeed.
Maybe he needs the track spinning faster to do his fancy hop overs, and on camera performance in the trees. Maybe hes after a lighter weight. Im not really sure.

Ive always said the 2.5 is a perfect all around track for a variety of conditions.

grounds speed its a direct result of track speed no? if you can move the track faster means more snow in and more snow out. wut ive noticed with my stocker 3in vs my turbo 3in is i literally cannot get it stuck.. ive purposely driven into tree wells just to prove this and it equates the the track being able to turn much faster... im wondering if that would be enhanced with a 2.5... or am i crazy?
 

kanedog

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Ground speed is not a direct result of track speed. Ground speed is a direct result of traction.
Ex. 55mph track speed on a turbo=30mph ground speed.

35 mph track speed on properly geared and clutched N/A=35mph ground speed.

This won't apply in set up snow or on trails as the turbo now has the traction advantage. Deep snow in the mountains only.

Don't believe me? Bring your turbo out on a deep day and we can line up in the deep. I'm gone and you are now making excuses for losing so bad. It'll be either that I cheated or yours is not running right. Sledders are funny af.
I'm such a tough keyboard warrior.
 
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mountainsledmania

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Ground speed is not a direct result of track speed. Ground speed is a direct result of traction.
Ex. 55mph track speed on a turbo=30mph ground speed.

35 mph track speed on properly geared and clutched N/A=35mph ground speed.

This won't apply in set up snow or on trails as the turbo now has the traction advantage. Deep snow in the mountains only.

Don't believe me? Bring your turbo out on a deep day and we can line up in the deep. I'm gone and you are now making excuses for losing so bad. It'll be either that I cheated or yours is not running right. Sledders are funny af.
I'm such a tough keyboard warrior.

yea... im going to have to disagree with you hard on that one. I have a properly set up N/A 3in sled and i can tell you there is not even a remote chance it would keep up let alone "be gone". and thats the same rider riding it so there not weight difference etc.
In order to make ground speed you have to spin the track and roughly the same speed as your desired speed with the exception of losses due to snow density and what have you. sure you may hit your desired or top speed faster because my track is spinning faster, BUT given the rite amount of distance and your sled runs out of legs.... in my opinion if we were to do such a thing wut would happen is the places you would get stuck the turbo would not. I am always game to ride with new people tho, not on a competition basis but i do like new riding buddies.
 

Caper11

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grounds speed its a direct result of track speed no? if you can move the track faster means more snow in and more snow out. wut ive noticed with my stocker 3in vs my turbo 3in is i literally cannot get it stuck.. ive purposely driven into tree wells just to prove this and it equates the the track being able to turn much faster... im wondering if that would be enhanced with a 2.5... or am i crazy?


Your comparing HP differences not traction.
Its not a direct relationship, traction is king. Especially at first wick of the throttle.
If yah spin long enough, and gain traction the track speed amd ground speed should equalize.
The ground speed is only checked with a radar gun.

I seen Gopro vid footage of a buddy at a drag race last year.
His speedo in 660ft said one thing but the radar gun said another. The track was so icy that the speedo showed 20kph higher than the radar gun. You could see him fighting the sled the whole 660ft.


Now remember when I said I believe the 2.5”
Is a better all around track. In marginal snow the 3” can actually hurt the climbing ability and a 2.5” can gain better traction, and get up to top ground speed faster than a 3”.
 
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kanedog

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yea... im going to have to disagree with you hard on that one. I have a properly set up N/A 3in sled and i can tell you there is not even a remote chance it would keep up let alone "be gone". and thats the same rider riding it so there not weight difference etc.
In order to make ground speed you have to spin the track and roughly the same speed as your desired speed with the exception of losses due to snow density and what have you. sure you may hit your desired or top speed faster because my track is spinning faster, BUT given the rite amount of distance and your sled runs out of legs.... in my opinion if we were to do such a thing wut would happen is the places you would get stuck the turbo would not. I am always game to ride with new people tho, not on a competition basis but i do like new riding buddies.
I like to ride with new buddies too. Im much more tougher on the net than in person. Lets ride!
Caper11 sez-"It's not a direct relationship, traction is king. Especially at first wick of the throttle.

If yah spin long enough, and gain traction the track speed amd ground speed should equalize."
Very true. Traction is why I can kick butt for no run at the hill for NA v Turbo because if I can prevent the turbo from getting his track speed equalling ground speed, I can win easily. But as soon the turbo track hooks up, I lose big time.
 
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mountainsledmania

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I like to ride with new buddies too. Im much more tougher on the net than in person. Lets ride!
Caper11 sez-"It's not a direct relationship, traction is king. Especially at first wick of the throttle.

If yah spin long enough, and gain traction the track speed amd ground speed should equalize."
Very true. Traction is why I can kick butt for no run at the hill for NA v Turbo because if I can prevent the turbo from getting his track speed equalling ground speed, I can win easily. But as soon the turbo track hooks up, I lose big time.

ride we shall. Ill PM ya

this is what im trying to figure out, theres an equation and in my head its something like ground speed= track speed- traction ( witch is a direct relation to lug height?) . im trying to figure out idf a 2.5 inch paddle would in fact be better, but then theres variables like snow pack and what not. Im honestly just trying to figure out how to build the baddest 5lb turbo machine there is. and im starting to wonder if buradnt actually rides turbo 2.6's just to do the hop over maneuver like was previously mentioned.
 

kanedog

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Baddest 5lb turbo sled is easy and it will rock.
Let's use my 16 xm NA 174 3" as a kind of template if you will. When using this combo, with the exception of the primary clutch and hood, you must must must follow it exactly. The components are a result of 3 years of testing, over 100 changes, tons of parts from all over the country and now I finally can beat turbos in deep snow. The combo is very sensitive to small changes in components so the more you stray from the combo, the worse it performs. It will still embarass 850's but we need to stay in the beat the turbo zone. Oh, don't listen to the doubters. They think if they haven't done it, heard of it, seen it or thought of it, it won't work. Haha.
16 xm NA 174 3"
Dynoport ypipe, ceramic coated
Stock pipe ceramic coated black
Thing cooker can, ceramic coated
Diamond s mesh hood
1.5degree added timing
Tra7 clutch
9.65g, yes, 9.65g pin weight
105/390 Duane Watt TRA Red spring
441 ramps
Stock arms & rollers
Sheaves cut to 14 degrees(you must machine the bottom of sheaves to achieve full shiftout).
Paragon 6 pack, 52/42, silver spring(90/200)
Custom 23/80 belt drive pulleys using tki kit
Mitshobishi 1250 length belt i think
Machine chaincase to fit bottom pulley
8t powderfreaks drivers
Driveshaft w/drivers trued on lathe
Razorback belt temp guage.

With some effort, this combo may work for other 2 stroke brands too.
The reason this works so well is traction, traction, traction. A turbo spinning at 120km is not going 120km ground speed. It's probably doing like 50kmh ground speed on a steep and deep big chew. Here's how it works-This NA setup does 75kmh track speed but is travelling 70kmh. #'s may vary but you get the general idea. 70kmh beats 50kmh.
This combo is so crazy I really can't believe it. It beats turbos easily in the deep. It sounds nuts and I agree it sounds crazy but I dont have anything to gain or sell by sharing this. I don't think that a NA sled will touch this combo for at least 5 years I'd say.
Throw a turbo on this combo, 3" track, raise the gear ratio to approx. 2.75 area,8t drivers, paragon red secdy spring, 55/60 helix(I think)60/200 aaen green p85 spring and light weights, prolly like 60grams. I have a turbo poo and that is what I run in the p85. Put a 911 cover on but you prolly got that already. Your turbo will make other turbo guys cry.
Naysayers welcome to comment. It'd be cool to hear some comnents on this outer space combo.
 
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mountainsledmania

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Baddest 5lb turbo sled is easy. Here's what I run on my 16 xm NA 174 3". If your gonna use this combo, with the exception of the primary clutch and hood, you must must must follow it exactly. The components are a result of 3 years of testing, over 100 changes, tons of parts from all over the country and now I finally can beat turbos in deep snow. The combo is very sensitive to small changes in components so the more you stray from the combo, the worse it performs. Oh, don't listen to the doubters. They think if they haven't done it, heard of it, seen it or thought of it, it won't work. Haha.
16 xm 174
Dynoport ypipe, ceramic coated
Stock pipe ceramic coated black
Thing cooker can, ceramic coated
Diamond s mesh hood
1.5degree added timing
8 tooth powderfreaks drivers
Tra7 clutch
9.65g, yes, 9.65g pin weight
105/390 Duane Watt TRA Red spring
441 ramps
Stock arms & rollers
Sheaves cut to 14 degrees(you must machine the bottom of sheaves to achieve full shiftout).
Paragon 6 pack, 52/42, silver spring(90/200)
Custom 23/80 belt drive pulleys using tki kit
Mitshobishi 1250 length belt i think
Machine chaincase to fit bottom pulley
8t powderfreaks drivers
Driveshaft w/drivers trued on lathe
Razorback belt temp guage.

With some effort, this combo may work for other 2 stroke sleds too.
The reason this works so well is traction, traction, traction. A turbo spinning at 120km is not going 120km ground speed. It's probably doing like 50kmh ground speed on a steep and deep big chew. Here's how it works-This NA setup does 75kmh track speed but is travelling 70kmh. #'s may vary but you get the general idea.
This combo is so crazy I really can't believe it. It beats turbos easily in the deep. It sounds nuts and I agree it sounds crazy but I dont have anything to gain or sell by sharing this. I don't think that a NA sled will touch this combo for at least 5 years I'd say.
Throw a turbo on this combo, 3" track, raise the gear ratio to 27/80, 8t drivers, paragon red secdy spring, 60/200 aaen green p85 spring and light weights, prolly like 60grams. I have a turbo poo and that is what I run in the p85. Put a 911 cover on but you prolly got that already.
Naysayers welcome to comment. It'd be cool to hear some comnents on this outer space combo.

hey if it works, i gotta say i cant believe it either. But im sure ill get to see it if we ride together.
 

mountainsledmania

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This kid is a big boy. If you are 300lbs + might want to give up on dreams of the hop over lol
Im 240, I can do the hop overs but i gotta say.... i dunno if it could do it without a turbo in deep stuff. theres just not enough ponies there.
 
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