The art of buying snowmobiles, and selling them.

skegpro · Feb 18, 2020

Looking for some old boy wisdom here.
I know there are some guys in here that have owned a machine or two in their day, I want to hear your learnings.
We kinda got into this in the turbo thread a little.

The goal is to run reliable iron every year, obviously.

How do you gauge depreciation?
By km?
By hr?
By year?
Depreciation Curve?

Should a guy aim to replace every year?
Every second year?
Four?

Guys that buy used sleds, what in particular do you look for?

skegpro · Feb 18, 2020

Ok Lets use ski-doo for a scenario, since more people here are familiar with doo.

2021 Summit Expert Package
N/A 850
165"
Shot

$18,849 CAD
(No Freight or PDI for easy figuring)
$19,791.45 with GST

Now you ride that for a season, 1500km- 2000km.

Can you sell it at the start of next season for $14,791?

Or would a person buying simply go and buy a hold over SP for around the same price?

Doesn't sell, okay.
Ride it another season now you have 3000-4000 km on, what do you sell it for?

50%? $9895

But it has two years of warranty left......

Year 3 4500km-6000km

Sell it for 25%? $5000

But it has a Year of warranty left lol

drew562 · Feb 18, 2020

I buy sleds more often than shoes. I sell them for what I’d pay. And if I have a buyer I work with him. He wants the sled. I want it gone. So ask questions. If a real young guy comes by and tells me he lives alone or with a room mate. Has apprenticeship going. Ect. I will give them a better deal. Help him out with a sweet sled. If daddy’s buying she’s full pop.

catinthehat · Feb 18, 2020

What a weird concept: selling a snowmobile. I thought you were supposed to keep them forever, that's why there is 17 in my yard. lol

skegpro · Feb 18, 2020

drew562 said:
I buy more sleds than shoes. I sell them for what I’d pay. And if I have a buyer I work with him. He wants the sled. I want it gone. I a,so ask questions. If a real young guy comes by and tells me he lives alone or with a room mate. Has apprenticeship going. Ect. I will give them a better deal. Help him out with a sweet sled. If daddy’s buying she’s full pop.

What's your replacement schedule?

drew562 · Feb 18, 2020

skegpro said:
What's your replacement schedule?

i buy two at once most times. A shorty 141-137 for home and marginal snow and 165 for deep mountain days. If the ditch banger works good I keep it two years. Mountain sled goes every season as it usually gets more miles.
I blew my knee last year so I’m still on my 2019 alpha. Surgery coming up soon. I’ve got over 20k in my alpha. I’d take $12,500 today. Has just under 3 yrs warranty left.

1200 · Feb 18, 2020

I think everyone has a different view on this . Myself if i like the sled and its reliable I try to ride it as long as possible. About 8 to 10k . All the time watching to see what is working and plan to buy at the end of the chassis. Like now i will buy a g4 when the new g5 comes out that way i get the best g4 they made . This way i dont get stuck with junk and lots of time to test ride and think about it. Also i dont sell the sell im riding i will sell the oldest in the fleet which will be my youngest kids sled and then we all move up . I have own all of the big 4 manufacturers not brand loyal but love this t3 xm but u never know maybe a sidewinder next.

canuck5 · Feb 19, 2020

drew562 said:
I buy sleds more often than shoes. I sell them for what I’d pay. And if I have a buyer I work with him. He wants the sled. I want it gone. So ask questions. If a real young guy comes by and tells me he lives alone or with a room mate. Has apprenticeship going. Ect. I will give them a better deal. Help him out with a sweet sled. If daddy’s buying she’s full pop.

I like this generally if you have an interested buyer work with him does that extra $500 matter nope it’s going to depreciate way more if you wait. I have also realized central Alberta stuff sells very well guys will come from Edmonton and Calgary to buy. My rules are two strokes (any brand) above 2500km are dead to me they are guaranteed to have an engine go sooner than later even with warranty that doesn’t mean anything if you have a $1000 chopper ride. Bearings, bushings, rollers, springs, shocks have all been beat up to. I rode 4 strokes for years engine always started but stuff gets worn out when you put 8000-12000km on a chassis on bumpy trails the rivets on your tunnel start to separate lol. From the prices we have seen with holdovers I believe it’s possible to ride new sleds buy them in March/April when dealers are moving them and sell them with 1000-1500km the next year take your $3000 on chin and repeat. That deprecation price is much less if you can scoop a used one with under 500km and way more if you go top of the line buying the next years model in November with new technology full accessories can probably lose $6000.

lilduke · Feb 19, 2020

have ran many sled over 10000km never seen a loose tunnel rivot. must be a yamaha thing.

my freeride chassis out lasted 3 motors...

I ve never sold a sled with less than 8000km on it.

buying a sled and riding it for 1000km makes no sense at all to me. if it makes sense to the sled sales experts, right on power to ya.

deaner · Feb 19, 2020

I added it up and I'm on sled number 15 since I got married (8 years ago). More a function of not being able to make up my mind about wanting to ride or do other things.

So here's my takeaway......if you watch the market there is always a range of what a particular sled will sell for. Some guys have no interest in getting top dollar, they just want to move the sled and get on with life. Some guys know what they have and are ok with waiting it out and dealing with 800 kijijitards to get the price they want. Personally I don't think either is right or wrong......whichever suits you.

I've noticed over 5000km is harder to sell. Even if it has new everything.....people don't want it. So imho not worth putting money into a high mile sled. Just dump it or part it out

Anyone interested in a super clean 2017 G4 with elka/zbros shocks?

Beels · Feb 19, 2020

Sleds are just one huge money pit, but dammit, they're sure fun to ride...

Still on my 2012 Pro 800. Haven't had much time to ride the last couple years and it's only got 1350 miles on it. Not worth fawk all so I'm just going to hang onto it for now.

gdhillon · Feb 19, 2020

For mtn sleds I’ve bought two higher mileage sleds in the past, with both sleds I was told they had fresh top ends...both sleds needed complete motors within the first three rides
Lesson I learnt, no more high mileage stuff

Now in between those two sleds I had bought a l eftover 14 pro rmk, I spent 13,600 on it. Didn’t ride it much, however that sled cost me 3x more then the two higher mileage sleds up front, and I think I had a tss issue right after warranty from what I remember that had a shop bill of $300ish

Anywho, moral of my story I’m not going new again and not older high mileage. My next sled I am aiming for 500-1000 km as posted above

And I wholeheartedly agree, this sport is the most fun, however it also can be the biggest headache, but without disappointment we can’t appreciate victory! Lol

pfi572 · Feb 19, 2020

Buy sleds in May and you will be fine .

You won’t pay to much .

ferniesnow · Feb 19, 2020

IMHO, sleds, horses, boats, and high maintenance chicks are much the same................money pits!

I've had a lot of sleds over the years and back in the olden days it made a lot of sense to trade in every year. There were no left over sleds to screw the pricing. A well maintained, high mileage sled was worth something.

This day and age with the OEM's pushing quotas on the dealers, it isn't good for the used sled business. The dealers have so many sleds to sell that high mileage sleds generally aren't taken in trade. Financing isn't available from "private Joe" and there isn't a lot of cash around.

Saying all of that, I am a high mileage dude and I want a dependable sled out in the bushes so that I don't have any hassles. I ride a new sled most years and pass that down to my wife for the second year. They are all in great shape and dependable as a two year old sled can be. Generally speaking, it costs about $6000/year for a new sled. With the higher mileage, the last sleds I've sold have all been under $10,000 and that is a big percentage change from the olden days.

Is it worth it. In my mind, yes it is. I haven't been stranded on the mountain, haven't had to do any work on the sleds (other than belt deflection, cleaning, inspections, gas/oil/grease, etc.), and I basically push the button and ride. As far as I know, the people who have bought our sleds have been happy with the deal and quality of the sled. IMHO, the price has been right and the sleds haven't been abused. It has been working thus far.

skegpro · Feb 19, 2020

I really thought when Rotax put direct oiling on the crankshaft bearings in the 850 engine reliability was gonna go way up, more on par with 4 stroke.
But in reality I think the 800 etec may have been a more reliable engine.

I agree the chassis can take 10,000km with no issues.

Has any looked into the cost of doing a swap on a running engine?

canuck5 · Feb 19, 2020

lilduke said:
have ran many sled over 10000km never seen a loose tunnel rivot. must be a yamaha thing.

my freeride chassis out lasted 3 motors...

I ve never sold a sled with less than 8000km on it.

buying a sled and riding it for 1000km makes no sense at all to me. if it makes sense to the sled sales experts, right on power to ya.

How much was your free ride in 2017? I’ll take a guess $17000 let’s say you get $3500 for that chassis. It still cost you $3300 a year over 4 years to put the miles on that thing and that’s assuming you didn’t put another cent into it in that time and your 3 motors were on warranty. What’s a sled trip worth if that motor goes down day 1 and your have to rent. My point is pulling wrenches on old iron gets old I did it and in the end it costs the same or more as rolling them every year or two without the headache.

lilduke · Feb 19, 2020

canuck5 said:
How much was your free ride in 2017? I’ll take a guess $17000 let’s say you get $3500 for that chassis. It still cost you $3300 a year over 4 years to put the miles on that thing and that’s assuming you didn’t put another cent into it in that time and your 3 motors were on warranty. What’s a sled trip worth if that motor goes down day 1 and your have to rent. My point is pulling wrenches on old iron gets old I did it and in the end it costs the same or more as rolling them every year or two without the headache.

hey what ever works for you. doing it your way how much does 12000km cost in depreciation?

lilduke · Feb 19, 2020

I can certainly understand wanting to snow check a new sled every year, is it going to cost the same as running your old junk? not a chance.

if you start with a pos, like a Polaris(haha) it could be a different story. quality sled like the freeride with 3 or 4 year warranty will last a you while...

Annacassandra · Feb 19, 2020

I don't know if there's really a surefire way to get the most bang for your buck with snowmobiles. It's all about luck and market conditions. I bought a left over 2016 in nov of 2017 so it was already two year behind but still brand new OTD was about 12,600 including accessories and tax (spare belt, oil, etc.) and just sold it for 8000 after two and a half seasons of riding it. I probably could have kept it for another year or two and still got 6-7000 for it but I wanted an 850 Khaos and someone wanted to give me cash for my sled so I seized the opportunity. I think the value on a sled drops the most in the first 2-3 years then after that slows down- so if you're averaging 5-600km a season I think it's worth holding on to a sled for as long as you can stand to but if you put 1000-1500kms on a sled each year you're probably best to roll into a new one each year. The km penalty isn't going to be as big on a sled that's only a year old and I think there are some small town dealerships that offer better pricing to customers that roll into a new sled every year.

canuck5 · Feb 19, 2020

This is defiantly my thinking going forward buy holdover machines between March and April very likely to put that 1000-1500km on a year. Try to keep yearly hit at $3000

The art of buying snowmobiles, and selling them.

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